Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

movingfulcrum.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 149 posts

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#21

Post by cube2222 »

acomjean wrote: post #14

I use both. Jetbrains is better, but it costs money. Its worth it to save the time figuring out eclipse. I use eclipse because I'm maintaining some tomcat code, and the code live in an eclipse project world. Eclipse works and once set up it does it job well. The truth is its just too complex. I still can't get it to work with Git. Eclipse is free (since I use it professionally I donated.) one example in Jetbrains I c…

I do think that the price as a cons being like 15$/month is kind of a negligible cost if you're using it every day for multiple hours.

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#22

Post by austincheney »

fs111 wrote: post #10
sungju1203 wrote: post #2

that's due to decreasing demand in java.

Do you have any evidence to back that statement up? Java seems to be as popular as ever.

Does it matter if they don't? People are entitled to opinions which may seem absurd. https://github.com/prettydiff/wisdom/blob/master/Avoiding_Tr...

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#23

Post by Elrac »

PeterStuer wrote: post #15

Being used to Visual Studio, every time I needed to use Eclipse I kept wondering how Java developers could tolerate such an environment. Now I know ofc some of it is due to less familiarity and exposure, but it realy felt like stepping back 15 years in time each time I launched it.

I'm not sure in what way your Eclipse experience was so atavistic, but I'd like to point out that at least for several years I was aware of, Eclipse had a significant competitive advantage:

Incremental compilation.

You could make a small change, do a Ctrl-S, and Eclipse would compile the change nearly instantly, where all competing products (that I was aware of, correct me if you know better) needed to fire up a Java compiler and feed it at least all changed source files. For me, this was difference of 2 seconds versus maybe 20-30.

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#24

Post by dominotw »

Elrac wrote: post #23
PeterStuer wrote: post #15

Being used to Visual Studio, every time I needed to use Eclipse I kept wondering how Java developers could tolerate such an environment. Now I know ofc some of it is due to less familiarity and exposure, but it realy felt like stepping back 15 years in time each time I launched it.

I'm not sure in what way your Eclipse experience was so atavistic, but I'd like to point out that at least for several years I was aware of, Eclipse had a significant competitive advantage: Incremental compilation. You could make a small change, do a Ctrl-S, and Eclipse would compile the change nearly instantly, where all competing products (that I was aware of, correct me if you know better) needed to fire up a Java…

> atavistic

I remember this word from the movie submarine.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1440292/

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#25

Post by vivaan »

fs111 wrote: post #10
sungju1203 wrote: post #2

that's due to decreasing demand in java.

Do you have any evidence to back that statement up? Java seems to be as popular as ever.

While it may be hard to show that Java's demand has decreased - and overall it may well not have since many companies which were using Java will continue to do so just by inertia - but for the latest generation of programmers, specially ones focused on ML / Data Science, Java feels like ancient history

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#26

Post by pwhegohw »

Aardwolf wrote: post #20

I started using IntelliJ in 2008 (so it was at version 8 I guess) and I liked it so much more back then. So many awesome features presented in ways that make sense. With Eclipse, I was stuck by the following weird design decision: All your personal preferences such as keybindings were not saved globally but as part of your current project. What were they thinking? Who would want different keybindings for different pr…

Eclipse Keybindings are stored per workspace. A workspace can be used to develop multiple projects.

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#27

Post by stephen »

"That era is now over."

Not sure that is true (pedantically), as my son is building Minecraft modules in CodaKid, and they have him using Eclipse, I'm sure b/c it's free: https://codakid.com/. (They have great classes, FWIW/IMO, not affiliated.)

I also don't get all of the "Eclipse is super-hard to use" comments in the thread.

Look, I love LPS and think that now that we have the luxury of local cross-process wire calls and being fast enough to provide butter-smooth IDE features, that is definitely the way forward as a cleaner, less-coupled architecture.

But whenever I pop open Eclipse, it's still faster, runs tests faster, debugs faster (for Java code), than VSCode does (for TS/JS code). Perhaps its Stockholm syndrome, but as a user I really don't think it's that bad.

Where I believe it is bad, and the OP alluded to this, is on the internals/plugin side of things; it sounds like life as an Eclipse plugin developer really, really sucks (see ScalaIDE/etc. pain), and given that the pre-LPS architecture of every IDE was "in-process plugins", that, IMO, is what really "killed Eclipse"/it's momentum.

Especially with open source, where people have to enjoy what their doing to contribute, and AFAIU I don't think I've heard of anyone every enjoying Eclipse plugin development.

But, anyway, LPS to rescue: democratized IDE development, all from within the safety blanket of your preferred language.

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#28

Post by rdlecler1 »

acomjean wrote: post #14

I use both. Jetbrains is better, but it costs money. Its worth it to save the time figuring out eclipse. I use eclipse because I'm maintaining some tomcat code, and the code live in an eclipse project world. Eclipse works and once set up it does it job well. The truth is its just too complex. I still can't get it to work with Git. Eclipse is free (since I use it professionally I donated.) one example in Jetbrains I c…

JetBrains is great. I happily paid for that over Eclipse.

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#29

Post by baud147258 »

JBReefer wrote: post #13

Still have no idea how to use Eclipse after 10 years. Vim, Emacs, VS Studio, VS Code, a few proprietary ones - very easy to figure out. Eclipse seems to be a magical combination of hard to use, slow, and hated. Was there a golden period? Was it great for awhile, and now is past it's prime, like MS Word?

In our use case, which is developping a project using Tomcat, I've found Eclipse to run rather well and not hard to use. So YMMV

Re: The Fall of Eclipse (2016)

#30

Post by ChristianGeek »

JBReefer wrote: post #13

Still have no idea how to use Eclipse after 10 years. Vim, Emacs, VS Studio, VS Code, a few proprietary ones - very easy to figure out. Eclipse seems to be a magical combination of hard to use, slow, and hated. Was there a golden period? Was it great for awhile, and now is past it's prime, like MS Word?

I used Eclipse for 5 years starting with 3.0 and hated it from day one. I started programming in Java shortly after it first became available and loved it. Eclipse managed to suck all the fun out of using it.
Post reply on HN