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How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

nathancunn.com

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Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#81

Post by rocqua »

nukeop wrote: post #63
neonhomer wrote: post #4

I don't understand the issue with paying to choose your seat on the budget airlines. My wife and I recently flew Spirit to and Southwest from our destination in the US. Even after adding bags and seat (we even paid for their big front seats) it was still cheaper than Southwest.

This is because you used to be able to sit wherever you liked once you boarded the plane, and only premium passengers could get a reserved place. Now they are reserving you a bad place beforehand, so you can't just sit wherever you like, and if you want to change that, you need to pay. What used to be free, is now being charged for, and there is little reason to do so other than "because they can" because it doesn't…

If a company raises prices 'because they can' and people keep paying, that is just how markets work.

In some sense, this leads to a better allocation of seats, as it allows those who desire some seats to pay for them, whilst those who have to preference get a cheaper flight. Now, people who used to be fine with the dice-roll of not paying get a worse experience. But this comes with the upside of those who really wanting the seats having a better chance.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#82

Post by rusk »

neonhomer wrote: post #4

I don't understand the issue with paying to choose your seat on the budget airlines. My wife and I recently flew Spirit to and Southwest from our destination in the US. Even after adding bags and seat (we even paid for their big front seats) it was still cheaper than Southwest.

Southwest is an interesting comparison actually.

Aren't they a budget airline that prides themselves on being friendly as well?

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#83

Post by [deleted] »

dazc wrote: post #78
leonk wrote: post #24

Little trick that I do when travelling as a couple: Get one randomly allocated seat, and then pay for the other one next to it (or as close by as possible).

You can't do that with some airlines though since random seats are allocated at check-in, not when you book. It seems like an obvious loophole I would have expected other airlines to have spotted?

[deleted]

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#84

Post by mannykannot »

dmurray wrote: post #15

The article assumes that Ryanair always gives middle seats to the first passengers who check in and don't pay for middle seats. The eventual conclusion is that you should check in later to avoid getting the middle seat. I don't see why the R analysis and pretty visualizations are necessary for that. Sadly the article lacks evidence that this is the algorithm Ryanair uses. They could equally well hold back the middle…

The article specifically says that there is statistical evidence showing that Ryanair does, in fact, preferentially allocate base-fare paying users to middle seats. Though the article does not explicitly say that the evidence supports a particular variant of the algorithm, your particular alternative does not seem to alter the underlying reasoning here, which is that if you check in late enough, all the middle seats have been allocated. Once that happens, you are not going to be allocated a middle seat, regardless of how the airline allocates the remainder. (This could, however, change your odds of getting a middle seat earlier in the process, and whether a later check-in leaves you more prone to being bumped (which I assume Ryanair does unless it is forbidden by law) is another issue to consider.)

Update: I see that Ryanair does not overbook, which puts some perspective on the complaints about it - I don't care about meals but I do about the risk of being bumped.

Update 2: I overlooked one part of the alternative algorithm, but I think that it actually makes it less likely: if they are holding back middle seats on the chance of upselling to later arrivals, where are they going to put those people? It seems that they are likely to end up with a bunch of middle seats with no chance of upselling even to passengers who would have done so, or possibly having (even more) disgruntled passengers who paid to choose but got a middle seat anyway, depending on exactly how this scheme works.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#85

Post by mrarjen »

isostatic wrote: post #69
maccard wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same is true for other airlines. Anecdotal, but I've been stranded in airports/on planes far more often with other airlines than I have with ryanair.

I've taken about 500 flights in the last decade or so, I can count on one hand the number of delays of over 2 hours * Moscow 2013 to Heathrow -- 4 more hours in the lounge, got €600 compensation. * Heathrow 2014 to Bangkok, 5 more hours in the lounge -- got €600 compensation. * Toronto 2017 -- delayed Delta flight to New York to catch a Virgin flight to Manchester so was downgraded and rerouted on KLM. No compensatio…

That EU261 is great yes, TBH I have earned money on the last 3 flights I have taken thanks to this system. All of those were long distance and had delays between 10 and 15 hour. It somewhat compensates for the lost time.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#86

Post by rusk »

mugsie wrote: post #59
rusk wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would take issue with this. The service with Ryanair is awful. I have never experienced rudeness from cabin crew of other airlines like I have of Ryanair.

For a 1 / 1.5 hour flight from DUB->LGW I honestly couldn't care how the cabin crew act.

To be clear, I'm not talking about "disinterestedness" I'm talking actual, abject rudeness.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#87

Post by rocqua »

Aardwolf wrote: post #3

Isn't aisle seat at least as annoying as middle seat? People walking through the aisle bump into your shoulder all the time, and the stream of people walking through it almost never stops. It's not like you can use it as leg space. Middle is worst of both worlds, except at least you don't get a constant stream of moving people right next to you

You definitely can use it for leg space, or rather, for knee space. You're not going to stretch your legs into the isle, but just poking out your knee a bit can give much desired relief for those with long legs.

For me on a budget airline, this tends to be worth it. Even more so if the person in front of me decides to recline their seat.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#88

Post by dazc »

clu3l355 wrote: post #37
KozmoNau7 wrote: post #2

Step 1: Don't fly on Ryanair. Just don't.

Compared to the other budget providers (Easyjet, Flybe [who frankly, aren't even budget prices]), they're miles ahead. The Easyjet routes I used to fly regularly were late every single time, and a member of airport staff told me ~50% of Easyjet flights were delayed in that particular airport. While Ryanair is certainly super basic, and they take every opportunity to sell you tat, they've been far more consistent and…

Agree Flybe are not always cheap but I find them much more laid back about checking in and such.

I recently had a friend visit me in Spain from the UK and he is a very nervous flyer. The way they treat him was absolutely commendable. I doubt he'd of even got on the plane with some other airlines.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#89

Post by rusk »

isostatic wrote: post #75
lumisota wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BA has a similar seating policy with its cheapest fares (pay to reserve, or have one allocated at random), and has lower seat pitch than Ryanair.

Yes, BA have gone downhill dramatically in the last few years -- I used to be a top level frequent flyer with them I've got a flight coming up next week with them to Nairobi, on a tired old 747, which I'm not looking forward to. In years past I'd paid a fortune for such a flight, now unless BA is at least £400 return cheaper than someone like Lufthansa, I won't fly them. I did fly BA in January (again to Nairobi), wa…

I often suspect with BA, that they actually purposefully make the economy experience worse than it economically needs to be, so that the difference with the more expensive tiers can be exaggerated. Often a fairly dismal experience, but their in-flight food is usually very good.

Re: How to avoid getting stuck with the middle seat on a Ryanair flight

#90

Post by nukeop »

rocqua wrote: post #81
nukeop wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is because you used to be able to sit wherever you liked once you boarded the plane, and only premium passengers could get a reserved place. Now they are reserving you a bad place beforehand, so you can't just sit wherever you like, and if you want to change that, you need to pay. What used to be free, is now being charged for, and there is little reason to do so other than "because they can" because it doesn't…

If a company raises prices 'because they can' and people keep paying, that is just how markets work. In some sense, this leads to a better allocation of seats, as it allows those who desire some seats to pay for them, whilst those who have to preference get a cheaper flight. Now, people who used to be fine with the dice-roll of not paying get a worse experience. But this comes with the upside of those who really want…

People keep paying because there's no other choice on certain routes, short of driving or taking a bus.

This isn't an upgrade or anything, people who wanted to pay to reserve seats could already do so. You could have also not paid, and picked whatever was available, switch with your neighbors, and so on. Obviously, since Ryan Air figured out that they can extract some extra bucks out of that, you're now assigned a place and can no longer just pick whatever is available once you board. This is a standard rent-seeking behavior with no advantage for the customers.

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