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What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

haveago.city

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Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#161

Post by 1123581321 »

nicky0 wrote: post #135
jessaustin wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you had biked in both places, you wouldn't doubt it. Sure not every autocager sees (or drives as if they see) a cyclist in the road, but the cyclist can see and hear everything around in way that's just not possible on the sidewalk. (I say this as someone who is missing one eye.) Also, cars aren't the only things with doors.

I feel like I'm missing something. I can't understand how it's more likely for a car to hit a cyclist on the sidewalk than the road. Cars drive in the road. They do not drive on the sidewalk.

I hit a car while riding on the sidewalk as it was exiting an alley. The problem is that when you are riding on the sidewalk in a city, the corners are too blind. In order to guarantee avoiding an accident you essentially need to stop at each driveway and alley. Most cyclists and drivers aren’t going to do that. On the road you are far enough back that you can see cars exiting; they can see you as well.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#162

Post by bunderbunder »

darawk wrote: post #127
bunderbunder wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fedex deliveries blocking the road for a short time are generally considered preferable to removing a whack of on-street parking from every block in order to have an excess of loading zones, or not being able to have deliveries at all. sidewalk signs for bars are regulated, at least in my city. They have to leave (IIRC) 6' of clearance on the sidewalk so they don't obstruct pedestrian traffic. Whether those rules are…

> Fedex deliveries blocking the road for a short time are generally considered preferable to removing a whack of on-street parking from every block in order to have an excess of loading zones, or not being able to have deliveries at all. You mean the way that the minor inconvenience of having a few scooters laying around is considered acceptable in return for having a cheap, efficient, green solution for last mile tr…

If it's just a few, that's not a big deal. But what a lot of people are envisioning isn't just a few scooters and bikes left around, it's the nuisance and eyesore of public areas being absolutely littered with these things that people are seeing in photos from cities that have had these services for a while.

I don't think they're wrong. I also don't think it's a non-solvable problem. It seems that the worst of it is largely due to there being simply too many of the things -- far more than are needed to actually meet the demand for short- to medium-distance transportation -- in many cities. Requiring companies to get a permit for each of their bikes so that the city has a way to limit the total volume, and so that it can ensure that the rollout happens incrementally so any apparent problems can be addressed before they create a major nuisance, would probably be more than sufficient.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#163

Post by [deleted] »

s0rce wrote: post #104
bunderbunder wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fedex deliveries blocking the road for a short time are generally considered preferable to removing a whack of on-street parking from every block in order to have an excess of loading zones, or not being able to have deliveries at all. sidewalk signs for bars are regulated, at least in my city. They have to leave (IIRC) 6' of clearance on the sidewalk so they don't obstruct pedestrian traffic. Whether those rules are…

"Fedex deliveries blocking the road" Preferable to cars, maybe, since it frees up parking, however, around here they simply park in the bike lane. I go by a UPS store daily and there are often 1-2 trucks both parked in the bike lane.

[deleted]

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#164

Post by owenversteeg »

YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #145

>> These new lightweight EVs keep most of the benefits of cars, cut travel times, are easy and convenient, help flatten hills, increase range, and marginalize fatigue and sweating, without the terrible drawbacks of cars: their enormous weight, size, danger, inefficiency, huge parking costs, pollution, expensive infrastructure, degradation of neighborhoods, etc. Everybody is trying to sell you something. The worst are…

Walking is simply not an alternative for moderate distance with a bike. For example, Google Maps's biking time for a common route near me (train station to university) is 6 minutes. Walking time is 26 minutes. The distance is 2km, so that's 20km/hr biking or about 4km/hr walking. I've tested this with longer distances and it seems to hold. In my experience, Google's biking speed is fairly spot on for me, and its walking speed is a bit faster than I walk. So I'd imagine that biking is at least six times faster than walking for me personally.

Also, if I really have somewhere to be, I can bike substantially faster and be OK, but running for half an hour with a heavy backpack and bags is much harder.

I spend a decent amount of time getting around on a bike - an hour and a half yesterday, maybe a half an hour today, so just the last two days alone I'd have spent twelve hours walking! That's totally unacceptable.

Finally, I imagine that biking (although easier) isn't that much less healthy than walking. Still much healthier than driving.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#165

Post by dwighttk »

d_k_f wrote: post #122
F_r_k wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you required to be public in order to make money ?

No, but it would make it possible to actually check whether they do or not, which I guess is why parent is asking.

yeah, just gives you numbers you can look at vs. just guessing.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#166

Post by comicjk »

stupidcar wrote: post #159
Angostura wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I seldom see cars driving on the pavement.

When bikes are ridden on the pavement, it's usually because road design and/or car drivers are making the road too dangerous for them. If you think about it, the pavement is not somewhere the average cyclist wants to be any more than a pedestrian wants them there. Even without people filling them, pavements are irregular, uneven and cluttered spaces, optimised for slow-moving bipeds who can stop, start and turn on a…

If my bike can't use the road, I dismount and walk it. Riding on the sidewalk is illegal. I don't begrudge anyone who does it perforce - say, if there are no alternative roads and they need to get to work - but I do begrudge cyclists who seem to forget that dismounting is even possible.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#167

Post by vladvasiliu »

darawk wrote: post #127
bunderbunder wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fedex deliveries blocking the road for a short time are generally considered preferable to removing a whack of on-street parking from every block in order to have an excess of loading zones, or not being able to have deliveries at all. sidewalk signs for bars are regulated, at least in my city. They have to leave (IIRC) 6' of clearance on the sidewalk so they don't obstruct pedestrian traffic. Whether those rules are…

> Fedex deliveries blocking the road for a short time are generally considered preferable to removing a whack of on-street parking from every block in order to have an excess of loading zones, or not being able to have deliveries at all. You mean the way that the minor inconvenience of having a few scooters laying around is considered acceptable in return for having a cheap, efficient, green solution for last mile tr…

I think it's a question of how those things are "laying around".

In Paris this is a relatively new development, but what I take issue with is where they are left by the users, which is usually in the middle of the sidewalk. People really don't care where they leave them since there's no consequence for them.

I ride a motorbike around town. In Paris it's legal to park motorbikes and scooters on the sidewalks if the sidewalk is wide enough as to not bother pedestrians. If the police walks by and thinks your vehicle is bothering, you get a ticket or could even have your bike towed. This has a direct impact on the owner.

If you park like a d... you risk your bike being tipped over, scratched, etc. Again, direct impact on the owner.

However, with a rental scooter / bike, you won't get any fines for parking in the middle of the sidewalk, most people won't care if something happens to the bike, etc, so they just don't care. Of course, if the company is getting the tickets and has to repair the bikes more often than otherwise necessary, the cost will be transferred to the users, but not in a direct manner. So in a society where people are on average less and less civil, I think this kind of development is to be expected.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#168

Post by paulgb »

dcosson wrote: post #41
hapless wrote: post #2

If Hertz or Avis attempted to use public space to park their inventory, local residents and city officials would pitch a fit. Public parking exists for the benefit of the public at large, not as a cost-saving measure for rental firms. The same is true of bicycles. You can store your private bicycle almost anywhere you like in public. But city fathers will naturally take a dim view of a business using that public spac…

> Public parking exists for the benefit of the public at large This is the point under contention. I strongy disagree, I would very happily give up public parking for other uses of that space - more bike/scooter lanes that can be further offset from fast-moving cars, dedicated space for Uber/Lyft dropoffs that don't block the roads, 5-minute loading/unloading parking for Fedex trucks and Postmates delivery people to…

Exactly. I'd add to this that benefiting the public at large vs. a company isn't exactly clear-cut. If I don't own a car, free parking doesn't benefit me directly, but having that space used for bikeshare docks does (even if this also benefits the bikeshare company). You could just as easily argue that free parking benefits Ford since it makes driving more feasible.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#169

Post by badwolf »

jonknee wrote: post #123
extra88 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the greater Boston area, I think I've only seen Zipcar spots on private property (though I'm not sure what the ownership is of the MBTA parking spaces) and I would expect the rate to be somewhat negotiable, based on supply & demand for the neighborhood.

There are car sharing services in Seattle that operate much like the scooters and bikes (park them in any city space, pay just for when you use, etc). The city charges a flat rate per car per month. Like dockless bike share it ends up being way more useful.

I love Car2Go here in Austin.

They pay the city some flatrate per year, and so car2go can park anywhere in public street parking without paying meters.

Re: What Dockless Bikes and Scooters Are Exposing

#170

Post by Lionsion »

CalRobert wrote: post #110
Lionsion wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US cities also tend to be more spread out, which also reduces the appeal of public transit. Contrast this to a Chinese city of the same size, which due to the fact that literally everyone lives in small apartments, is much more compact and easier to serve via public transport.

"US cities also tend to be more spread out, which also reduces the appeal of public transit." Also could be US cities have no transit, requiring space-intensive auto infrastructure, so they're more spread out.

No, American cities are more spread out mainly because many Americans don't want to live in small apartments, and cars enabled that.

Public transit is much less convenient and desirable when the 1) distance between adjacent stops is too large, 2) there are too many stops between different destinations, and/or 3) the stops at a particular location are too infrequent. I think all of those undesirable factors increase as density decreases.

Using a personal car effectively reduces #1 to zero, #2 to zero, and increases #3 to infinity.

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