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Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

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21–30 of 87 posts

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#22
Some ones I've seen and liked -

"If you're not doing anything wrong in your living room, why draw the curtains?"

"We should save paper by sending people their bank statements on postcards. If you're not doing anything financially shady, you should be okay with the postman seeing it."

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#24
May I suggest reminding people of Martin Niemöller's famous statement post WWII? It begins "When [they] came for the socialists, I remained silent. I was not a socialist." It ends, "When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out."

This exaggerates the downside of handing over lots of information to a third party to use however they please. But it points out the assumption that "I", whoever "I" happens to be, am somehow privileged above "them." It's remarkably easy for "I" to turn to "them."

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#25
I think the concerns over privacy online are overblown for many people but I try to be smart about what I do and put online. So I think part of it might be the framing of the situation. Rather than trying to convince them that they do actually have something to hide, it might be more effective to try to convince them that their attitude should be more like, "Don't put anything online that you don't want everyone to know" and also explain that there are people who do worry about things like people who have been in abusive relationships, people who might be in places where not being straight and cis gendered is not accepted and so on.

I think it might also be good to ask yourself, "What do I want to accomplish by convincing this person to be concerned about online privacy?" and think about ways to accomplish that goal.

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#26
I would ask to rifle through their phone right in front of them.

There's a subtle difference between something you'd want to hide (because it could be incriminating) and something you don't want made public (because it could be embarrassing). I have nothing incriminating, but I have embarrassing stuff on my phone that I would rather nobody looked at.

A phone is an intensely personal device where a lot of your private data resides, and it can reveal a lot of intimate things about you and your relationship with others. Many people do understand this (at least at an instinctive level) and would balk at the idea of someone invasively reading all this stuff on their phone.

It's one I plan to use on airport security if they ever order me to decrypt my phone without a warrant.

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#27
post #15

A more aggressive example that seems to get the idea through to people: > Would you be OK with the police installing a camera in your house? Don't worry, they'll only look at it if they think you've done something wrong, you can trust them on that. Totally. You've got nothing to hide, right? I think non-tech people don't quite realise what sort of footprint they leave online, whereas the idea of a camera being in you…

I have found that many people are not really too concerned about it. There is a home security company here that sells an alarm system and one of the indoor movement sensor units has a built in camera.

No you do not have any access to the camera. No, there is no indication that it is active. No, you can not opt out. No, you can not see any source (I asked). "But it will only ever be used when there is an alarm to verify".

And most of the people go: "Sure, sounds reasonable!"

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#28
post #20

This is maybe a controversial approach, but it works really well. Agree with them and say it is fine you have nothing to hide at this moment, but you are not important now. There are politicians, high ranked officials and a lot of other people that impact your life without you knowing that they can be influenced/blackmailed because of the lack of privacy. Maybe your future self really dislikes your lack of hiding rig…

You could even paraphrase Martin Neimoller's well-known (if not the author himself, I didn't until I looked him up) poem[0]:

    First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—

    Because I was not a Socialist.

    Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—

    Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—

    Because I was not a Jew.

    Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
I think the message is just as relevant (and powerful) to personal liberties as it is to groups of people.

[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#29

Using police as an example since I don't trust Facebook at all. For me the turning point was when I realised that while I have nothing to hide from police or governments today I might have something I wish to hide from governments in 2030. For a real world example of this, see Turkey - a country that was quickly approaching western standards but turned around in less than 2 years. Also, while I trust local police tha…

I usually reply with something similar to this. I try to remind them that the definition of "wrong" has evolved over the course of history - sometimes dramatically and quickly.

The things you freely discuss on on a platform today could become socially unacceptable tomorrow and evidence against you the day after that.

Re: Ask HN: What's a good response to “It's fine, I've got nothing to hide online”?

#30
They may not care about their own privacy but they should care about privacy online as a whole because there are most definitely people who have legitimate reasons for privacy such as journalists, activists or politicians. If they don't care about online privacy ask them if they also don't care about racism because they are not black or a minority.
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