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Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

cbc.ca

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Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#71

Post by astrodust »

cryptoz wrote: post #3

Wow. The trauma inflicted upon the children in the family when the Canadian government bursts into their house can never be undone or taken back. Nor can the financial and mental, emotional stress of losing their computers and ability to do productive work and go to school. (Edit: will there be any reparations for this abhorrent behaviour? Have they apologized? Will they, at least? Not that it matters, the damage to…

It's worth noting this sort of thing is highly unusual which is why it's getting so much media attention.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#73

Post by cookingrobot »

eboyjr wrote: post #64
dustingetz wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i can see how the older generation is thinking though, they see it like leaving a window unlocked doesn’t mean you can the laws are interpreted and applied by powerful people in a way that suits the way they think - that much i think could have been predicted (but not by a teenager) did the weev ruling surprise anybody other than hackers?

Since it helps the older generation to think about digital content in metaphors, I'd argue that the kid was entering through an open window of a public building. Although a bit strange, no one would give this hypothetical person a third look.

How about looking into the display window of a shop? If they wanted to keep something secret, it should have been out of sight.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#74

Post by marzell »

CosmicShadow wrote: post #11

Not the kind of response I would expect as a Canadian. Can't they send someone undercover ahead of time to find out it's just some kid at his family house and then take the appropriate response? There are better ways to handle this, and there are certainly better ways to secure government files! If it's publicly accessible, it's public information. Obfuscation doesn't count!

There really should be accountability of whoever chose to store the data in an insecure manner.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#75

Post by Magi604 »

He's archived portions of 4chan?

It's likely then that he's gotten some "bad" stuff without him really knowing it. The police will search through his files, find the bad stuff, and charge him with some sort of possession/accessing/downloading charge.

Life = ruined.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#76

Post by jellicle »

whack wrote: post #55

This might be a controversial opinion here, but intent does matter. If I see a bunch of stuff sitting the sidewalk and I take some because I think it's free, that's a reasonable thing to do. But going into someone's house and taking their tv is not. "It's their own fault for not locking the door" isn't a valid legal defense, and I would prefer not to live in a country where victim-blaming becomes a get-out-of-jail-fr…

That's because we know what a "house" is - a bunch of private property with a wall around it (even if the wall is not locked). Usually comes in sets with other bunches of private property with walls around it. And we know the default - you aren't welcome in those walled forts unless you are welcomed in by the owner.

Not at all clear that files on a public webserver look very much like a private house.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#77

Post by inetknght »

eigenvector wrote: post #38
phnofive wrote: post #14

Seems like a move by the provincial government to shift blame from its poor security to an imaginary bad actor; this article also from the CBC goes into more detail and asserts that fraudulent intent is necessary for a conviction, so hopefully this goes nowhere. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/concerns-teen-bein...

Yes, it's really not clear that any crime was committed. The relevant section of the Canadian Criminal Code[1] requires either fraudulent intent or some actual manipulation/destruction of the server - not simply downloading data. It seems like overreach by the police to distract from the fact that the government failed to secure private data. [1] http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-342.1.h...

Honestly, I'd like to see the kid's lawyers push back and claim damages against the province and its contractors.

How else shall we force problems like this to be fixed?

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#78

Post by brandon272 »

whack wrote: post #55

This might be a controversial opinion here, but intent does matter. If I see a bunch of stuff sitting the sidewalk and I take some because I think it's free, that's a reasonable thing to do. But going into someone's house and taking their tv is not. "It's their own fault for not locking the door" isn't a valid legal defense, and I would prefer not to live in a country where victim-blaming becomes a get-out-of-jail-fr…

A publicly accessible HTTP web server is not analogous to a locked home.

The kid sent a request to the server for a document and Nova Scotia's web server graciously provided the content with a "200 OK" response code. The Nova Scotia government doesn't know how the internet works.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#79

Post by kazinator »

eigenvector wrote: post #38
phnofive wrote: post #14

Seems like a move by the provincial government to shift blame from its poor security to an imaginary bad actor; this article also from the CBC goes into more detail and asserts that fraudulent intent is necessary for a conviction, so hopefully this goes nowhere. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/concerns-teen-bein...

Yes, it's really not clear that any crime was committed. The relevant section of the Canadian Criminal Code[1] requires either fraudulent intent or some actual manipulation/destruction of the server - not simply downloading data. It seems like overreach by the police to distract from the fact that the government failed to secure private data. [1] http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-342.1.h...

Anyone familiar with the Streisand effect would have predicted that this would in fact result in this failure getting as much attention as the circumstances can imaginably furnish.

Re: Teenager facing prison for downloading unsecured files from government website

#80

Post by Kelbit »

dumbfounder wrote: post #7
swampthinker wrote: post #2

Am I crazy? Aren't FOIA requests, by definition, public information?

This happened in Canada. They might have a FOIA equivalent, but I wouldn't assume it has the same rules as in the US.

In this case, most of the documents were public, but there were a small number which had confidential information and were inappropriately stored on the public portal.
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