The greatest problem of the article critiques is that China economical politic is working. They aren't just the almost slave workers now, there are tech and innovation.
China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
161–170 of 228 posts
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#162Some threads are discussing Chinese companies, at C-level, doing business in Chinese language in US. I'm curious to know opinions folks around the world have about the likelihood that Chinese language will somehow become an important international language? In my (perhaps biased) mind it appears the world is already well on its way to adopting English as THE international language.
I think it's very unlikely that (today's) Chinese will become a dominant language because it's too hard to learn. The writing system is just awful. Maybe if they manage to adobt Pinyin or something similar as the official way to write Chinese it has a chance. But until then I doubt that many foreigners will start learning it.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#163Would a more accurate description be that China is "militarizing," its tech sector instead of "nationalizing" it? When we think of nationalization, we tend to think of centralized control by committee, removal of competition, five year plans etc. But militarization of an economy, like that of Britain during WWII, means working toward and pricing based on a shared (if mandated) national objective. Western aviation is…
You make an excellent point about nationalization being an inaccurate metaphor.
China sees it tech industry as a strategic asset the way the US and Russia see their defence industries as strategic towards advancing their goals as super/regional powers, so in a sense, militarization is probably a better metaphor.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
China has a billion people and produces vast and rapidly growing numbers of highly skilled academics, both in their local universities and by sending students abroad. Many of the smartest people I know are Chinese and have returned to China after completing their degrees and collecting experience in western companies.
I don’t want to take a side but the parent is almost certainly going to point out that academic papers != innovation (especially with the news that lots of papers from China have falsified data, paper mills, etc). What are actual innovations made by China in the past 20 years? On demand bikes comes to mind as one example.
I'm no expert on the matter, but I hear that they have excellent supply chains and extremely flexible assembly lines.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#165Some threads are discussing Chinese companies, at C-level, doing business in Chinese language in US. I'm curious to know opinions folks around the world have about the likelihood that Chinese language will somehow become an important international language? In my (perhaps biased) mind it appears the world is already well on its way to adopting English as THE international language.
I’d just like to point out that no Lingua Franca has lasted forever. It was French before English, till post WW2.
Also this doesn’t matter as much, but, English is one of the more difficult languages (compared to Spanish say) due to all of its spelling inconsistencies and large phonetic possibilities. I don’t know if a tonal, character based language will be any easier though.
I say it doesn’t matter because it doesn’t seem to be the difficulty of learning the language that matters, only the strength of the language in terms of economic opportunities.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#166All tech companies need to re-think manufacturing in China, it was always a risky proposition, but not, you'll really be handing your IP over to the Chinese Government, and they'll be collecting IP from every company. It's time for tech manufacturing to move.
Where will it move to? Tech manufacturing is till pretty labor intensive, at least for the consumer electronics that I believe we are talking about. India probably has better IP laws on paper, but they're hardly ever enforced. The only real alternative seems to be that we reach such a level of automation that these factories can be viable in the West. Still, China's integration into the supply chain of global manufac…
I fear it might even be too late. Tech-hotspots like Shenzhen are so highly specialized on producing any kind of tech extremely fast, that the Western world cannot replicate that without massive costs that would instantly double all hardware prices. The kind of expertise needed to create those manufacturing powerhouses might not even be in Western hands anymore.
Nowadays, if you are a hardware start-up that needs specialized components, you don't start in the EU or NA - you go to Shenzhen to get your prototypes cheap and super fast. Often within two days from design to working prototype.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
> China is the pro-trade side. They'll be willing to make concessions, do the work, etc. It's the beijing consensus now, not washington. China isn't pro trade per se. They're pro export, in the old mercantilist sense. They've spent the last 30 years heavily restricting trade access into and within China by foreign entities. They'll amass around a $900 billion to $1 trillion trade surplus with the EU over the five yea…
>the West keeps falling for it for some reason The west acted as if mercantilism basically couldn't work. Ricardian theory of comparative advantage was elevated to near-religion status in the 90s and early 00s. China not opening up fully was seen as an aberration that would ultimately only harm China rather than a potential long term threat. That was the prevailing attitude among policymaking circles (you can see thi…
I got some lessons in that religion in the early 00s, and think it's still gospel in a lot of circles (I certainly know a few vigorous proponents).
Is there a school of thought that's superseded the Ricardian theory?
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
As someone with parents who experienced the USSR, this is what really terrifies me about China's rise, and the reason I can't say I'm against a trade war if it hinders them more than us. Imagine a world in which China holds more control... a country with little legal or social respect for individualism, where your fate is 'centrally planned' by how impressive your maths skills are. By contrast, ~30% of American billi…
I think that's a severe misrepresentation of China. They're communist in name, but extremely capitalist in practice. Jack Ma is the man behind Alibaba and now one of the richest people alive, let alone Chinese alive. Check out his background [1]. In my opinion, the main difference between China and the US is nationalism. And that's also what I think that slogan is indicative of. It also, I think, explains their gover…
> They're communist in name, but extremely capitalist in practice.
Which is orthogonal to individualist.
State power serves individuals largely to the extent that influence is well-distributed over a population (and that population cares enough to be attentive and thoughtful).
Markets serve individuals largely to the extent that purchasing power and a reasonable level of information symmetry are well-distributed over a population (and mostly for areas in which incentives are well-aligned).
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#169Actually this is not even close to nationalization. The article's title is misleading even by the standard's of the article, which goes on to call it, "quasi-nationalization". But even that is misreading the situation. The objective is not "control" of the tech sector as the article pretends, it is just greater collaboration. So the state and tech companies can both benefit. The state doesn't want the burden of takin…
You claim: > The objective is not "control" of the tech sector as the article pretends, it is just greater collaboration. From the article: > This quasi-nationalization applies to China's startup scene, too. One recent report found that 60 percent of Chinese unicorns have either direct or indirect investment from the BATs. China's venture-capital sector is dominated not by traditional tech dealmakers but by the state…
> These stakes give the Chinese government control over these startups.
Does it? Any more than it already has, what with China being communist and all.
I don't see why the general ideas /u/reeedom discusses can't be true, and can't turn out to in fact be a perfectly workable way to successfully run an economy. This isn't to say it's not risky and scary, with so much power in the state, all it takes is one tyrant to come along and screw everything up, but this is something altogether different than believing it is impossible to govern a society successfully in this form, for a very long period of time.
Re: China Is Nationalizing Its Tech Sector
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
Where will it move to? Tech manufacturing is till pretty labor intensive, at least for the consumer electronics that I believe we are talking about. India probably has better IP laws on paper, but they're hardly ever enforced. The only real alternative seems to be that we reach such a level of automation that these factories can be viable in the West. Still, China's integration into the supply chain of global manufac…
I fear it might even be too late. Tech-hotspots like Shenzhen are so highly specialized on producing any kind of tech extremely fast, that the Western world cannot replicate that without massive costs that would instantly double all hardware prices. The kind of expertise needed to create those manufacturing powerhouses might not even be in Western hands anymore. Nowadays, if you are a hardware start-up that needs spe…
Nationalizing the tech sector will have a negative impact on its growth and innovation.