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Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

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Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#41

Post by pixl97 »

urda wrote: post #21
nightcracker wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Louis Rossmann, who openly admitted to using illegally obtained schematics and internal documents from Apple? Are you seriously trying to discredit a man for doing exactly what he's fighting for? It's like trying to discredit a politician that's pushing for the abolition of jaywalking by saying that he jay walks himself. No shit - that's the whole point.

I'll repost the same thing here, since apparently this is confusing to some HN users this morning: > So you're discounting someone's opinion because they were forced to use unauthorized repair manuals because the manufacturer stopped producing repair manuals for devices customers have paid for? Yes, because it's a legal case we are discussing here and that's called "breaking the law". Failing to understand that means…

"I'm sorry, I can't discuss this case with you because you won't sit at the back of the bus, like the law says" --You 60 years ago

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#42

Post by kazinator »

ksk wrote: post #27

I worry they're going to come after us programmers next. Only "authorized" programmers will get the access code required to change anything. Microsoft, Apple, Dell, etc will control the access codes. "Programming is hard, and these untrained self-taught programmers can mess up your machine, they might install malware, or they might be hackers, or they might overclock your CPU and damage it, or they might use the syst…

> I worry they're going to come after us programmers next.

That ship sailed decades ago.

> Only "authorized" programmers will get the access code required to change anything.

Stallman. Laser printer firmware. `nuff said.

Speaking of Stallman and Apple: have you heard of this? It was formed in reaction to Apple's actions:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_for_Programming_Freedom

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#43

Post by [deleted] »

urda wrote: post #39
Someone1234 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Drop the attacks and focus on the article, this is HN not reddit. You cannot credibly post that when you yourself minutes earlier posted this: > Failing to understand that means I cannot discuss this article with you at all since a really important common understanding has been missed on your part. Want to follow your own advice?

> > Failing to understand that means I cannot discuss this article with you at all since a really important common understanding has been missed on your part. > Want to follow your own advice? That's not a personal attack at all, and if you think it is you really are lost here on HN. So I'll remind you again and end further discussion: I cannot discuss this article with you at all because not only did you fail to see…

[deleted]

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#45

Post by logfromblammo »

ksk wrote: post #16
urda wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Louis Rossmann, who openly admitted to using illegally obtained schematics and internal documents from Apple? I wouldn't be throwing that name around as a talking point at all in this discussion. The reason why Apple doesn't want any Joe-schmoe just yanking and replacing caps and other components is simple: quality control. I can barely count on two hands people I would be comfortable working on the innards of a PC,…

>The reason why Apple doesn't want any Joe-schmoe just yanking and replacing caps and other components is simple: quality control. I can barely count on two hands people I would be comfortable working on the innards of a PC, let alone my phone and even then let alone desoldering and soldering new components onboard. And yet people are perfectly OK with a greasy mechanic fixing their metal cage hurtling down the freew…

Quality control only happens on premises you control. Once the product reaches the point-of-sale terminal, the consumer own it, and the QC job is done. You send your product out onto the free market and have to hope you raised it well enough to uphold your brand.

It isn't about QC; it's about money. It's the same reason every car dealership has an in-house repair department. Branded repairs mean that people can still buy the brand after they already own the product. Counterfeits cut into that revenue stream.

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#46

Post by cptskippy »

dpkonofa wrote: post #2

This will get canned on the appeal, guaranteed. The article is a bit misleading because they're not going after him because he's doing aftermarket repairs. They're going after him because he's claiming that the repaired devices are using genuine parts from Apple, which even have the Apple logo on them, yet they weren't purchased from Apple. This is my biggest complaint with the "Right to Repair" movement. They're con…

> They're constantly conflating what Apple is fighting against (counterfeit parts and being compelled to provide documentation and manuals without oversight) with the valid complaint of users not being legally allowed to repair their own devices. Apple has never been against that and isn't fighting that.

Apple is setting up an environment where counterfeiting is practically necessary by hindering legitimate repairs using non counterfeit non genuine parts.

Apple doesn't allow those who aren't Authorized Repair Centers to purchase genuine replacement parts or to have access to service manuals. I'm not aware of another OEM that does this. I can go to HP, Dell, Samsung, MSI, Acer, or LG and purchase genuine parts or download service manuals. Apple posts service manuals online but they go out of their way to lock them behind a login so that only Authorized users can see them.

Apple has bricked iPhones during iOS upgrades if those devices weren't using genuine Apple displays.

Apple has bricked iPhones during iOS upgrades if you replaced the touch ID, regardless of whether it was a genuine part or not.

The iPhone X camera module is a separate part form the display yet if you replace the display genuine or not while keeping the original camera module, it stops working for facial authentication.

Apple disabled the ability to adjust the brightness of your Macbook's display if it wasn't genuine. Hey maybe it doesn't want to damage non genuine displays... so what's the difference between a genuine and non genuine part? The EEID that Apple programs into them. A counterfeit display in this case is simply one that was purchase from Apple's supplier, LG, and programmed with Apple's EEID not by Apple.

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#47

Post by comboy »

mattsfrey wrote: post #30

"Apple does not ‘own’ the product after they have sold it" I think this is the crux of the issue. The guy was importing refurbished parts with the logos covered even. They weren't counterfeits. How does a manufacturer have the right to sue for copyright infringement when it's just end users reselling authentic parts? The owner even states he in no way markets them as OEM parts. Frankly I think it's pretty obvious app…

I don't think they want to squeeze every cent. I think they just care about the brand. They want people who bought iphone to have the best experience they prepared for them. Even if you buy some used iphone. If somebody buys some used iphone and it acts weird or the build quality seems imperfect because some parts were replaced, then this person may spread opinion that iphones suck.

I'd guess that's their reasoning. But I'm not on their side here. I think they should be allowed to design products to make repairs as hard as possible if they want to, but once I buy it I should be able to do whatever I want with it. Plus there's not that much great experience to protect lately..

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#48

Post by dang »

urda wrote: post #20
Someone1234 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Louis Rossmann, who openly admitted to using illegally obtained schematics and internal documents from Apple? I wouldn't be throwing that name around as a talking point at all in this discussion. So you're discounting someone's opinion because they were forced to use unauthorized repair manuals since the manufacturer stopped producing repair manuals for devices customers have paid for? That's the whole crux of the…

> So you're discounting someone's opinion because they were forced to use unauthorized repair manuals because the manufacturer stopped producing repair manuals for devices customers have paid for? Yes, because it's a legal case we are discussing here and that's called "breaking the law". Failing to understand that means I cannot discuss this article with you at all since a really important common understanding has be…

Please don't cross into personal swipes. If you can't discuss something, it suffices not to discuss it.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#49

Post by dang »

Someone1234 wrote: post #37
urda wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And yet people are perfectly OK with a greasy mechanic fixing their metal cage hurtling down the freeway at 65 miles per hour. Your attempt to demean skilled repair workers is rather telling of your own bias. Woah I didn't know you could read my mind! For a matter of fact, I'm also very picky on who works or touches my car just for your information. Drop the strawman it's unbecoming. Second, there's an entire indus…

> Drop the attacks and focus on the article, this is HN not reddit. You cannot credibly post that when you yourself minutes earlier posted this: > Failing to understand that means I cannot discuss this article with you at all since a really important common understanding has been missed on your part. Want to follow your own advice?

Please don't engage in petty spats here, regardless of how wrong or annoying you find other comments.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Apple Sued an iPhone Repair Shop Owner in Norway and Lost

#50

Post by shkkmo »

mattsfrey wrote: post #40
Someone1234 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this exactly how iOS works currently? You literally cannot develop for it without signing an Apple contract (even non-App store apps require a user account/agreement).

Technically that's just them locking you out of their distribution platform, I don't think they'd have a legal case against you though. People sell apps outside of the app store and haven't suffered any recourse from apple, at least not that I know of. EDIT: I guess you do have to technically agree to their terms to use the SDK and such, but if one were to get a hacked copy or whatever I think it'd be legal. They can…

How would a hacked copy make it more legal. Wouldn't using their software without a license also be illegal?
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