Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail • Hacker News Board

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#11

Post by gfo » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 2:56 PM UTC

lovetrump wrote: post #2

> It says that the recipient won’t be able to forward email content, copy and paste, download or print the email. DRM for email? that worked so great for the media industry... No thanks.

This is a feature available to enterprises in Exchange server and it works quite well, especially for messages with sensitive content.

The key difference is that emails are typically intended for those the message has been sent to and not for broad distribution - they can contain sensitive content that would cause harm if broadly distributed (e.g. server names, passwords, financial data, etc.)

Media on the other hand, is intended for broad distribution but only after you've purchased a 'license' to use it.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#12

Post by supermdguy » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 2:57 PM UTC

I wonder how "destroyed" an email is is when the NSA/FBI wants to read it a year later. Google has no incentive to actually protect the content of "self-destructing" or any other type of emails, so it's dishonest for them to pretend to provide a private email service.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#13

Post by peatmoss » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 2:58 PM UTC

This is only possible if one believes in the capacity to control client security on the other side. There’s also the problem that something viewable by the recipient’s eyeballs is also photographable by the recipient’s camera.

Moreover, I worry about the new Gmail feature that undermine the open platform of email. Email is just about the last unwalled comms platform we have, and I really worry for its safety if gmail thinks it can start differentiating network effects on gmail vs network effects on email.

I switched my vanity domain over to Fastmail a while back. I haven’t had any regrets. New features like this make me even more glad.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#14

Post by simplicio » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 2:58 PM UTC

Seems annoying. No one would rely on this to keep actual sensitive info private, since you can just screen shot it.

On the other hand, part of the point of Gmail is that it makes your emails easily searchable, so you can quickly dig up info from old mail rather than have to make a note of said info in some sepearate program/notebook/whatever. But if emails are going to randomly be disappearing, it could really cripple that utility.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#15

Post by TremendousJudge » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 2:59 PM UTC

kome wrote: post #9

Please, let's not "disrupt" the email: it's so beautiful because it's so standard. For example, google's dot rules already (ko.me@gmail.com = kome@gmail.com) make no sense and break many applications: they need to stop. I like innovation, but to innovate email wouldn't be better to innovate in a slow and consensual way using RFC after RFC, at least in the case of email?

email was killed by spam, current email is sadly a walking zombie that's getting eaten by maggots

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#16

Post by w0m » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 3:00 PM UTC

kome wrote: post #9

Please, let's not "disrupt" the email: it's so beautiful because it's so standard. For example, google's dot rules already (ko.me@gmail.com = kome@gmail.com) make no sense and break many applications: they need to stop. I like innovation, but to innovate email wouldn't be better to innovate in a slow and consensual way using RFC after RFC, at least in the case of email?

> it's so beautiful because it's so standard

I think it's really the opposite, every provider tends to introduce new/unique/nonstandards but they (mostly) interact at a minimum with eachother.

Re: gmail DOT and + notation, those have been in common use on that platform for over a decade.

>I like innovation, but to innovate email wouldn't be better to innovate in a slow and consensual way using RFC after RFC, at least in the case of email?

RFC to what body? To the best of my knowledge the entire thing is just a happenstance of what happens to work in every client/server combination.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#17

Post by BenoitP » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 3:02 PM UTC

akrasuski1 wrote: post #4

Uhmm... screenshot the mail; self-destruction circumvented.

It wouldn't prevent humans from remembering the mails, too.

But screenshots are easily faked, and IMHO might (and should) not hold up in court. This is the equivalent of hearsay.

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#18

Post by peatmoss » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 3:02 PM UTC

matthewaveryusa wrote: post #7

What a bunch of hype garbage this is. If you send something in plaintext to a server it's already game over. If Google was serious about privacy it would pgp-encrypt everything so only the client, client-side can decrypt it, just like what protonmail does. pfff, 'self destructing emails', what a heaping pile of razzle dazzle no-ops that is -- this is more likely subliminal advertisement for the new mission impossible…

I feel like client-side email encryption is a missed opportunity for Apple. Easy encrypted email would fit nicely into their narrative of “we can offer privacy features that Google can’t, because we sell you stuff”

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#19

Post by oceanstone » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 3:02 PM UTC

supermdguy wrote: post #12

I wonder how "destroyed" an email is is when the NSA/FBI wants to read it a year later. Google has no incentive to actually protect the content of "self-destructing" or any other type of emails, so it's dishonest for them to pretend to provide a private email service.

Pretty sure Gmail isn't being used for ad targeting anymore https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/06/23/technology/gmail-ads.h...

Re: Google is testing expiring emails in the new Gmail

#20

Post by sp332 » Fri, Apr 13, 2018, 3:06 PM UTC

matthewaveryusa wrote: post #7

What a bunch of hype garbage this is. If you send something in plaintext to a server it's already game over. If Google was serious about privacy it would pgp-encrypt everything so only the client, client-side can decrypt it, just like what protonmail does. pfff, 'self destructing emails', what a heaping pile of razzle dazzle no-ops that is -- this is more likely subliminal advertisement for the new mission impossible…

This isn't for cases when you don't trust the recipient. This is for plausible deniability for both of you. If someone is monitoring your email, they will get the link to the content but they won't be able to read it.