Live data from Hacker News

Project from Hell (2008)

projectfailures.wordpress.com

11–20 of 157 posts

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#11

Regarding this part: "they had to pay soon for Free Software. None of them ever mentions ‘Software Libre’, but they all know about ‘Software Gratuit’. " In French, we have two word for Free: Libre is for free as in free speech and gratuit is for free as in free beer.

Which we had to borrow to distinguish the two, thus LibreOffice (which is also conveniently GratuitOffice).

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#12
post #4

And there are people who claim performance doesn't matter, only correctness does. Hmm.. Also: we chose C++, because it is fast.

> And there are people who claim performance doesn't matter, only correctness does. Hmm..

Performance is meaningless if the code is not correct.

After all, I can make the code arbitrarily fast if I'm not going to be held to any standard of correctness: It always returns "FOOBAR". Done, and very, very fast.

> Also: we chose C++, because it is fast.

That is a bit naive. C++ is a standard, so how fast is a stack of paper?

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#13
post #9

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost in translation.

That would be the notice period. Germany is similar, it tends to be 6 weeks to the end of the quarter, and it generally applies to both employee and employer. Though it often isn't quite as applicable to the employee...what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you?

> what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you?

They would fire you for grave offense (I'm not sure what the right word in English would be). But even firing or giving one's notice is long here, around three months.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#14
> It is forbidden to come to work after 9am. One day, the site manager stayed behind the main gates and fired on the spot every person who came in after 9.01am, including a number of managers and sales.

This surprised me. I thought it was extremely difficult to fire people in France.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#15

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost in translation.

You have to work for 3 months before you can quit an employer in France. It's not "at-will". At least that's how I interpreted it, and given France's stronger labor laws I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.

No, it's the length necessary before the process is finished. You give your resignation and the contract is terminated 3 months later.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#16
With a moment of silence in sympathy for this poor sod who is sharing a special level of pain few of us have encountered...

> With so many files in store you may think that two people working on the same file would be rare, but it turned out that most work happened within the same 100 files or so.

Not really surprising, unfortunately. This is a hallmark of the Big Ball of Mud. Thousands of code files and yet people keep tripping over each other.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#17
post #9

>Average turn-over for the newcomers: 3 months, the legal time to leave your job in France. Can someone explain the meaning of this? I think something got lost in translation.

That would be the notice period. Germany is similar, it tends to be 6 weeks to the end of the quarter, and it generally applies to both employee and employer. Though it often isn't quite as applicable to the employee...what are they going to do if you don't show up, fire you?

At least in New Zealand, if you abandon your job, the employer can bill you for any costs incurred, e.g. if they had to get a worker from a temp agency, you'd have to pay for the worker, or at least pay for the extra costs of a temp worker.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#18
Another comment regarding this:

"In a country like France, corruption is not uncommon at that level, goes mostly undiscovered and is rarely prosecuted. "

My brother is working in a construction bussiness in France and he has a handfull of stories of this type of high-level corruption (house built for the ex-mayor, refection work done for a lawyer, invitations to Roland-Garros...). But as the author have said, it's the same thing everywhere.

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#19
post #2

Doing a first checkout requires taking an appointment with the version control team, usually granted a week later. Editing files is not permitted without authorization from middle management. Ah, I recognize this. It is a special level beyond workplace hell, Tokugawa shogunate hell , where the entire organization is structured to provide as much busywork for as many superfluous management layers as possible. Fifteen…

Yeah but think of all the sweet swords and armor you can have when you have a dozen people to carry your stuff...

Re: Project from Hell (2008)

#20
> 12 years after [1996], the project is still active. The company recovers daily penalties by billing ever-increasing change requests to the government. The year is 2008.

So this was a project for a government agency in France that limped along for years.

Post reply on HN