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Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

nytimes.com

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Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#281

Post by alkonaut »

jamiethompson wrote: post #274
alkonaut wrote: post #230

I once saw a cashier compare the signature on the back of the card (There is a little field for "signature" on the back of credit cards) - to the one I signed. When I noticed I hadn't signed my card he said he couldn't accept my purchase, so I had to sign the card first, then he could compare the signature...

In the UK cards still have a signature strip on the back and if a merchant notices you haven't signed your card they legally have to refuse to accept it. I rarely remember to sign my cards and this tripped me up one time last year when trying to return something to a store which I'd bought online with my credit card. I had to leave the store, buy a pen, sign the card and re-enter the store.

> I had to leave the store, buy a pen, sign the card and re-enter the store.

That's exactly what I did too. And yes, this was when visiting the UK. I had no idea the strip on the back of the card was for comparison, never seen it used elsewhere. Would be interesting to hear the person who thought that the signature-comparison thing was a good idea explain how they were thinking.

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#282

Post by bruxis »

azinman2 wrote: post #195
post_break wrote: post #141

Can we also standardize the noise the machine makes when the transaction is a success? You know that sound "ENGHH ENGHH ENGHH" that is somehow a positive sound? It's like an alarm clock sound. Why is it not a positive "Ding!" And some will say well it's to remember your card. Well if that's the case, how about force the POS system not to print the receipt until the card is pulled? Or better yet, why does the card hav…

Visit Japan and you’ll hear ATMs play a little tune as they hand you money. The sound design everywhere you go is amazingly and thoughtful. America can be way too brutalist.

I'd love to find these, as I'm in Japan and the only ATMs I've used angrily yell at me with a loud "ERRR ERRR ERRR" sound.

It comes off more like "Get your money and get the hell out" than a pleasant tune.

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#283

Post by patio11 »

ascorbic wrote: post #217
gregpilling wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a landlord, I always request cash or cashiers check for move in money. I don't want you living there for 3 months for free while I fight your bad check through the court system to get you evicted. It may sound shocking, but some people will do this. Source: me, landlord since 2001.

Why not a bank transfer?

Tenant: "Reverse this payment from 6 weeks ago."

Bank: "Why?"

Tenant: "Well my landlord [tale of woe]."

Bank: "So I'm hearing that the payment was unauthorized."

Tenant: "Yes!"

Bank: "Reversed."

Landlord: "... YOU DID WHAT?!"

Bank: "sigh We don't want to be in this discussion."

Landlord: "YOU HAD ONE JOB!"

Bank: "It's not sitting between two adults trying to figure which of them screwed the other. We've got courts for that. Good luck."

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#284

Post by arghwhat »

blueside wrote: post #8

Signatures haven't been required for credit cards in many other countries for quite some time now. I have often wondered why the US has historically lagged behind for everyday banking. (e.g. email money transfers, chip enabled cards, pin number verification, tap to pay)

DK never even had credit card signatures. Our systems support it for foreigners, but I was so confused the first time I saw that.

Everyone uses NFC credit cards now (and if the amount is over ~$40 or a daily limit has been reached, with pin).

For us, chip and pin is basically deprecated, and no one has used magnetic strips in a decade.

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#285

Post by teddyh »

skookumchuck wrote: post #17

It turns out that a signature on a bank check means nothing. Neither does the payer name on the check. Not the amount in cursive. Nor does the check paper. The only things that are checked are the digits of the amount, and the account number. The rest of the check can be complete garbage, and the check will go through and the bank will pay it. Then the banks will blame you, the account holder. I learned this the hard…

Really?

http://www.wastedtalent.ca/comic/unavoidable-result

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#286

Post by arghwhat »

kirillseva wrote: post #13
blueside wrote: post #8

Signatures haven't been required for credit cards in many other countries for quite some time now. I have often wondered why the US has historically lagged behind for everyday banking. (e.g. email money transfers, chip enabled cards, pin number verification, tap to pay)

because legacy tech wants to be amortised over long time periods. If you start implementing things later you can pick the best tech. US banking was among the first to become digital and thus still has to maintain technical choices of the past

The resistance to change can be explained much simpler:

It benefits only consumers, while costing the banks and payment providers. It's the same excuses for still having critical banking infrastructure written in COBOL.

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#287

Post by Jolter »

I found it odd that Mastercard would say "[...] it has been wanting to make the change for years, but held off until cards embedded with computer chips became common."

Whose responsibility is it to make those cards more common, if not Mastercard's?

In Sweden, cards have only been issued with chips since the early 2000s, and consequently merchants only very rarely use signature purchases. Why they didn't push this sooner in the US is a riddle wrappen in a mystery...

The only place I've seen signatures used recently around here have been in busy bars/nightclubs, where stressed-out bartenders don't want to wait for online validation. I guess they get few enough fraud attempts at cocktails that they don't care too much about validation.

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#289

Post by drfuchs »

InclinedPlane wrote: post #134
skookumchuck wrote: post #17

It turns out that a signature on a bank check means nothing. Neither does the payer name on the check. Not the amount in cursive. Nor does the check paper. The only things that are checked are the digits of the amount, and the account number. The rest of the check can be complete garbage, and the check will go through and the bank will pay it. Then the banks will blame you, the account holder. I learned this the hard…

This is untrue. The signature and the amount in cursive do matter, but not in the way most people think, they matter only after the fact. If a check is unsigned and someone cashes it then you can usually get that money back in small claims court, though not always. Or if the signature doesn't match on a check you can use that to convince your bank that the check is fraudulent. Also, if the amount that the check was c…

Back in the day, I had a case of the opposite problem: my check to the phone company got cashed for $89.89 rather than the $89.98 that was due, even though I had written both the digits and the spelled-out version of the number indisputably correctly. So PacBell decided to slap me with a $35 fee for not paying my balance off on time. The cancelled check that I had in hand clearly showed that the mistake wasn’t mine, and it also had been imprinted with the wrong amount at some processing step along the way. Needless to say both the bank and PacBell declined to take any responsibility, and it took a lot of time on the phone before getting a sympathetic rep who could reverse the fee “for goodwill“.

Surely this must not be a unique case; what’s supposed to happen in this sort of situation?

Re: Credit Card Signatures Are About to Become Extinct in the U.S

#290

Post by sandworm101 »

Signatures have never had anything to do with identity. They are a physical manifistation of ones willingness to contract. They draw the line between drafts and final contract language. The action counts, not the image.

That signatures are somwtimes compared is secondary, akin to comparing paper types or forensic prints. Contracts are not like a signed bat. They do not become worthless because you forget to cross your T.

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