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Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

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Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#61

Post by he0001 »

This article highlight a really interesting point here:

Trust.

And even if there are the “proof-of-work” people are going to distrust that “it’s a mathematical proof”. Just look at Trumps alt-facts and “fake news”. You don’t need to go even that far to find people putting money under the mattress because they distrust authorities. And even if math is “universal” people are going to mistrust it because they don’t understand it. I don’t think they will ever trust bitcoin. And I think they are in a majority.

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#62

Post by bwoodring »

kaolti wrote: post #6

One thing is sure, if you're hanging on to the past you'll always lose in the end. That's not to say blockchain is the be all and end all, but constantly hunting for arguments why something will never work , is not only terribly boring, but IMO the most counterproductive way to look at anything.

That's pithy, but there's no particular reason to believe it is true. You may find futurism amusing, but the future is not guaranteed to be better unless we make good decisions. The fact that something is futuristic does not make it inherently better, and believing that is does is just the mirror version of traditionalism.

There is ample evidence that stable, predictable institutions are the main driver of improved quality of life in the west. The libertarian instinct to tear down these institutions instead of putting in the hard work to make sure they are well run is counterproductive.

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#63

Post by coldtea »

kaolti wrote: post #6

One thing is sure, if you're hanging on to the past you'll always lose in the end. That's not to say blockchain is the be all and end all, but constantly hunting for arguments why something will never work , is not only terribly boring, but IMO the most counterproductive way to look at anything.

>One thing is sure, if you're hanging on to the past you'll always lose in the end.

Well, people chasing after the latest fad lose much faster...

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#64

Post by kaistinchcombe »

jeremyjh wrote: post #50
bllguo wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there's literally a link in the comment. Show some effort please..

Imagine a few different personas, such as investment banker, retail store owner, and soccer mom. Then complete the following sentence: I need a decentralized time ordered log so that I can ...

People say that a lot about the internet – that nobody knew what it would be useful for at the time it was invented. It had MORE uses than originally foreseen (same as computers) but one of the internet pioneers chimed in on the comments thread to the first article saying that actually they did know exactly why they built the internet at the time they built it: they wanted a better way to send messages and share files, so they built one, and the day it was built it was the best way in the world to do that. Same with IBM - scope wasn't foreseen, but those machines were the best in the world for the purposes they were designed for.

But the myth that people create amazing technology that has no use (TCP/IP, the computer), and then a decade later people discover what it's useful for, is just that: a myth.

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#65

Post by coldtea »

slededit wrote: post #60
cortesoft wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a clear example of survivor bias; there have been plenty of things that people thought were the future that turned out to be false, and the people who ‘hung on to the past’ and didn’t adopt those things won out in the end. Betamax, 3D TVs, laserdiscs, segways, new coke, etc.

Cryptocoins appear to have drastically more adoption than any of those.

Pet rocks did too at one time...

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#66

Post by kaistinchcombe »

slededit wrote: post #60
cortesoft wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a clear example of survivor bias; there have been plenty of things that people thought were the future that turned out to be false, and the people who ‘hung on to the past’ and didn’t adopt those things won out in the end. Betamax, 3D TVs, laserdiscs, segways, new coke, etc.

Cryptocoins appear to have drastically more adoption than any of those.

Depends on how you define "adoption" doesn't it?

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#67

Post by coldtea »

cvaidya1986 wrote: post #54

It’s going to be interesting reading these articles ten years from now.

It's already interesting reading articles about how Bitcoin would be dominating already by now written several years ago...

Are we going to wait much longer for the Rapture?

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#68

Post by cowpig »

> Venmo is a free service to transfer dollars, and bitcoin transfers are not free

Venmo is not free. There's a cost, it's just hiding.

> Blockchain-based trustworthiness falls apart in practice...

The particular brand of trustworthiness the author is arguing against is indeed a myth, but that doesn't mean blockchain is "crappy technology" or "a bad vision for the future"

Blockchain adds a new thing to the world: digital property that cannot be reproduced for free.

Smart contracts add another new thing to the world: the ability to build immutable software that interacts directly with the financial system.

Both of these ideas are very powerful, and almost all of the interesting blockchain projects are still in the R&D phase.

The hype around blockchain is ridiculous and absurd, but that doesn't mean the technology isn't exciting or potentially transformative.

edit: I actually wrote an article about the "trustlessness" thing: http://cowpig.github.io/bitcoin/ethereum/poker/cryptocurrenc...

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#69

Post by wolco »

cortesoft wrote: post #44
kaolti wrote: post #6

One thing is sure, if you're hanging on to the past you'll always lose in the end. That's not to say blockchain is the be all and end all, but constantly hunting for arguments why something will never work , is not only terribly boring, but IMO the most counterproductive way to look at anything.

This is a clear example of survivor bias; there have been plenty of things that people thought were the future that turned out to be false, and the people who ‘hung on to the past’ and didn’t adopt those things won out in the end. Betamax, 3D TVs, laserdiscs, segways, new coke, etc.

Many of those items changed forms and exist today. If this was 10 years ago you can add 3d printing or solar panels. Some technologies take time to develop.

Re: Systems built on trust, norms, and institutions function better than blockchain

#70

Post by kaistinchcombe »

localhost3000 wrote: post #34

"Instead of relying on trust or regulation, in the blockchain world, individuals are on-purpose responsible for their own security precautions. And if the software they use is malicious or buggy, they should have read the software more carefully." This is also one of the aspects of "the blockchain" that I struggle with. I don't think normal people want this or should be expected to do this effectively. And once you o…

FWIW, my position in the world is protecting vulnerable seniors and people with special needs from fraud. So part of my view that this isn't a better recipe for trust is coming from that perspective - just imagine telling a person with alzheimer's that their life savings are gone and it's their own fault for downloading a virus…
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