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Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

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Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#11
post #2

> 80,945 against and 75 in favor Life in a democracy?

At least to me, this is the system working.

Of course anything surrounding Michigan, Nestle and water is going to attract attention and serve as the backdrop for uninformed people to vent their anger. And despite all the backlash the adminstration followed the law and the right call was still made.

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#12
> Nestlé's request to the Michigan Department of Environmental Quality to pump 576,000 gallons of water each day

For perspective, all of Michigan uses 9 billion gallons of water each day. Nestle will be using 0.006% of what the state uses.

Looking just at groundwater, Michigan uses 690 million gallons of water per day. Nestle will be using 0.08% of what the state uses.

This is irrelevant. And I'm glad the personal opinion of 80k comments was ignored.

Source: http://www.michigan.gov/deq/0,4561,7-135-3313_3684_45331-370...

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#14
post #10
post #2

> 80,945 against and 75 in favor Life in a democracy?

From the article: >> But despite deep public opposition, the agency concluded that the company's plan met with legal standards. I’ll take equal interpretation of the law over mob rule any day of the week.

Short and direct - well stated and agreed.

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#15

The Muskegon River (the main drainage for the area) has a discharge of 1,450 cubic feet per second at Evart, Michigan (where this facility is located). That is about 11,000 gallons per second, or about 937 million gallons per day. The facility proposes to pump about half a millon gallons per day. Tempest, meet teapot. https://waterdata.usgs.gov/mi/nwis/current/?type=flow

I don't know the particulars in this case but is Nestlé going to pay proper amount for this water? If the public doesn't want the plant then shouldn't their desires carry some weight? Especially since it doesn't appear that Nestlé would be providing a service in the interests of society at large.

Overall there is a growing sense in the U.S. that public assets are being sold off at below market rates. That corporate interests trump public interests. There's a lack of trust in the system. The overreaction, as you put it, here seems to me to be a symptom of what I think is a growing lack of trust in the system.

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#16

The Muskegon River (the main drainage for the area) has a discharge of 1,450 cubic feet per second at Evart, Michigan (where this facility is located). That is about 11,000 gallons per second, or about 937 million gallons per day. The facility proposes to pump about half a millon gallons per day. Tempest, meet teapot. https://waterdata.usgs.gov/mi/nwis/current/?type=flow

Isn't that apples and oranges, comparing the numbers like that? The river is connected to the water table, sure, but surely the issue is more complicated than that?

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#17
post #3
post #2

> 80,945 against and 75 in favor Life in a democracy?

We Americans like to claim we live in a republic and not a democracy, but we live in a broken republic too.

The problem is, at this point the "representation" is far too removed from the governed... Very few people "know" their representatives (local, state and federal alike). And the public image is very manipulated. Unfortunately, people no longer vote for who they feel is a better person, but who is in their party and has a better smile and message.

In the internet age, it's almost worse with the sheer amount of disinformation which cannot be contained or offset in both directions, for the better or the worse of a given candidate.

It's disillusioning and outright sad. That doesn't even account for external pressures and interests.

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#19
post #15

The Muskegon River (the main drainage for the area) has a discharge of 1,450 cubic feet per second at Evart, Michigan (where this facility is located). That is about 11,000 gallons per second, or about 937 million gallons per day. The facility proposes to pump about half a millon gallons per day. Tempest, meet teapot. https://waterdata.usgs.gov/mi/nwis/current/?type=flow

I don't know the particulars in this case but is Nestlé going to pay proper amount for this water? If the public doesn't want the plant then shouldn't their desires carry some weight? Especially since it doesn't appear that Nestlé would be providing a service in the interests of society at large. Overall there is a growing sense in the U.S. that public assets are being sold off at below market rates. That corporate i…

> I don't know the particulars in this case but is Nestlé going to pay proper amount for this water?

I suspect the value of untreated groundwater in Michigan is very, very small.

> there doesn't appear that Nestlé would be providing a service in the interests of society at large.

What about jobs? What about the people who want to buy bottled water? Why don't the workers and consumers count as "society at large"?

Note: I personally think most people who buy bottled water are foolish (unless the local tap water is unsafe or unpalatable), but then people do a lot of things I think are foolish.

Re: Michigan OKs Nestlé Water Extraction, Despite Public Comments Against It

#20
post #10
post #2

> 80,945 against and 75 in favor Life in a democracy?

From the article: >> But despite deep public opposition, the agency concluded that the company's plan met with legal standards. I’ll take equal interpretation of the law over mob rule any day of the week.

The holocaust was legal, slavery was legal, segregation was legal. If you use the state as a metric for ethics you'll end up disappointed.

-- @lex_looper

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