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Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

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Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This just made me realize how much of a pass Youtube gets compared to Uber. Youtube expects you to provide it with content and it may arbitrarily choose to never pay you for your work. With Uber you will at least get something.

With uber you are paid when you serve a customer. Creating content, on its own, is not serving either a customer or an end user, so there can be no expectation of payment.

Well, there are at least some cases in which Youtube pays people who upload videos. When a Youtuber does get paid, who is the customer?

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#442

If you search her name on twitter, around 40% of what you see is right wing conspiracy theorists who assert, without evidence, that she was a member of ISIS. I also noticed a smaller percentage of people asserting, again without evidence, that she was an NRA member. And neither appear to be true. How do these get spread on Twitter? Are partisans mindlessly voting them up? Are bots behind this? Man, do I feel stupid f…

> Man, do I feel stupid for thinking the internet would be a force for good. That it would promote democracy, free speech, and critical thinking. The internet is a tool and like any tool, it can be used for both good and evil. It depends on the people using it. In fact, the internet is arguably a victim of it's own success. It has democratized thought so well such that people whose ideas are morally depraved have the…

>The internet is a tool and like any tool, it can be used for both good and evil.

I prefer to view the internet as amplifier. Per se, it's not good or bad. It just amplifies whatever it has on its inputs. The inputs of early internet were nerdy, but we mistook this nerdy utopia of internet as good force for axiom. Now internet amplifies whatever humans are and boy its ugly.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#443

I'm sorry that she shot the wrong people, but despite absolutely not condoning resorting to violence, I can't say I'd feel bad had she shot the person that took away her livelihood.

That reads as condoning it despite your saying you don't—and that breaks the site guidelines. Please (re-)read them and follow the rules if you want to keep commenting here.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#444

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But were them though? I don't see reasons for the views in her videos indicating those problems.

Many Youtuber's pay for a package of Bots to watch their videos. You can get 1 million views for less than 10 dollars. It used to be a great way to cheat Youtube and Advertisers, but they have gotten better and better at catching it. My guess is that she probably did this. You can still get away with it big time, if the bots are not the majority of your traffic. If you just use them to get to sort of prime the pump.…

She could have bought the views. But if she did and she knew she did, she wouldn't have been so outraged when she doesn't get any money then. I guess this person was genuinely feeling being ripped off by Youtube because she really had an audience but then with no money in return.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Isn't it possible that her content just wasn't that good? Even so, she still had 366,591 views, which should all that matters re revenue.

Are you sure? There are certain coveted demographics that advertisers are willing to pay a lot more money for than others. I don't think it's true that all views are counted the same for monetization purposes. And then there's views that are desired so little (e.g. those on whacko conspiracy theorist channels) that advertisers aren't willing to pay to put ads on them at all, and you end up with "demonetization".

>Are you sure? There are certain coveted demographics that advertisers are willing to pay a lot more money for than others. I don't think it's true that all views are counted the same for monetization purposes.

I'm not saying any kind of 350,000 views will pay the same -- but unless there's something off (e.g. monetization off, copyright infringement, etc) 350,000 views pay substantially more than $0.1 whether the demographic.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many Youtuber's pay for a package of Bots to watch their videos. You can get 1 million views for less than 10 dollars. It used to be a great way to cheat Youtube and Advertisers, but they have gotten better and better at catching it. My guess is that she probably did this. You can still get away with it big time, if the bots are not the majority of your traffic. If you just use them to get to sort of prime the pump.…

She could have bought the views. But if she did and she knew she did, she wouldn't have been so outraged when she doesn't get any money then. I guess this person was genuinely feeling being ripped off by Youtube because she really had an audience but then with no money in return.

>If she did and she knew she did, she wouldn't have been so outraged.

Maybe a rational person would think like that...

But besides knowing she wasn't a rational actor because of the crime she committed, if you spend any time in with the criminal justice system you will find many people 'feel' they have a right to things, even if they procured them illegally.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#447
post #439

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike cars, corporations are at least made of people. If you steal from a corporate-owned store, is that a victimless crime?

In that case you're robbing the people who own the corporation (shareholders). They're the victims, not the corporation itself. A corporation is owned by people. It is not "made of" people like some grotesque colossus.

If we can assign victimhood to the shareholders then surely we can assign blame as well? Seems like you’re just slightly moving the pointers with no actual consequence here.

People got shot and HN commenters are using it as a platform to criticize content policies of the company they work for. That is the pertinent thing here. Semantic quibbles about which specific entities count as the “victims” are not terribly relevant.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last time I checked, jobs from lawyers and doctors to gravediggers and street sweepers are still there. Nobody was promised to be a YouTube icon.

>Nobody was promised to be a YouTube icon. That's right, but if you're going to try to make a living creating content, you have to be able to provide for yourself. Outside of advertising, there aren't that many options for generating income - and most of the time, you have to do all of them (adverts, patreon, live appearances, swag sales, etc.) to make a living because individually they aren't enough. And this is wha…

> There is something off-putting about expecting some of those guys to devote hundreds of hours creating their content and then criticizing them because it's not free enough

I don't think this is "expected" of anyone. "YouTube creator" is not a career, it's a glorified hobby that can sometimes be lucrative, most of us wish we had the time and financial freedom to mess around with our hobbies and get paid for it but at the end of the day this is a fickle dream that one cannot reasonably expect to work out.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#449

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A position doesn't become "relativism" just because you don't want to hear it. It's not relativism to point out that people have responsibility for their actions, nor to point out that mental illnesses do not generally make people homicidal. Regardless of what is ultimately found out about the case, people were claiming mental illness before they had information to support that, as they do in nearly all of these case…

Mental illness is described in terms of deviance from "normal" behavior and conformance to generally accepted morals. I think this is trivially proven from a lay read of the DSM. A shooting spree in reaction to an website's policy change is both immoral and irrational. No conceivable context would make that chain of actions acceptable. How could one look at this action and assume mental illness does not exist? It's n…

>Mental illness is described in terms of deviance from "normal" behavior and conformance to generally accepted morals. I think this is trivially proven from a lay read of the DSM.

Deviation from normal behavior and generally accepted morals is absolutely not a definition of mental illness. A bank robber isn't mentally ill by virtue of robbing a bank. I don't believe you've ever read the DSM in any of its editions.

>No conceivable context would make that chain of actions acceptable.

No one said they were acceptable.

>How could one look at this action and assume mental illness does not exist?

People do horrible, outrageous things without diagnosable mental illnesses all the time.

>Saying mental illness exists based on their behavior is not even close to the same thing as saying that they did not have culpability for their actions, and it's both unfair and disingenuous to imply I did.

The assumption that any horrible, irrational crime must be due to mental illness--obviously this diminishes culpability. Have you never heard of pleading insanity? If someone is genuinely out of their mind, they cannot be held responsible for their actions in the same way a normal person would be held responsible.

Re: Suspect in YouTube Shooting Posted Rants About the Company Online

#450
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a pity that Google terminated those accounts - I don't know what scrutiny scares them. Because they don't want to encourage people to gawk at the death spectacle? This includes all the times a suicidal killer leaves behind a manifesto that could serve to inspire copycat killers.

Google can censor someone as effectively as any government. This is, in effect, the same as the government banning a book. It's not something I'm ever comfortable with, and I'm especially uncomfortable with it when it's an unaccountable company in charge.

> Google can censor someone as effectively as any government

How so?

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