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Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

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Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#551

Post by yellow_postit »

reaperducer wrote: post #497
deathanatos wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My last couple of jobs have given me no choice aside from a MBP and OS X. They do this because they don't want to manage multiple kinds of machines from an IT perspective. (I'm not sure I agree with this, but it is what it is.) Depending on how widespread this is, usage may not reflect actual user desire (though I would wager quite a large number of users either don't care what they're using, or care, but a MBP is ad…

> My last couple of jobs have given me no choice aside from a MBP and OS X. They do this because they don't want to manage multiple kinds of machines from an IT perspective. Not that many years ago that was the same reason IT departments would give for only giving people Windows machines.

Apple shot themselves in the foot for this market with the touch bar. It adds such a small amount of utility for annoying every VIM user.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#552

Post by mcculley »

djrogers wrote: post #348
sydney6 wrote: post #313

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think that long term they are much better off controlling their entire hardware stack. But CPU/GPU aren't the only chips Apple is sourcing from 3rd party. Think wireless modems like WiFi, LTE, etc.

Close, but Apple already produces it's own WiFi/BT chipsets (the S1/S2 etc SOCs in Apple watches for example, and the W1 chipset in AirPods and new Beats headphones), and is rumored to be working on an LTE/GSM chipset. I think Apple is intensely interested in controlling the entire stack.

If Apple were to make their own LTE modem, does that mean we might get one in a MacBook Pro?

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#553

Post by emodendroket »

htormey wrote: post #391
emodendroket wrote: post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't a number of iOS apps use essentially the same technique?

Most if not all of the top 100 mobile apps are native applications. Hybrid mobile frameworks like Cordova tend to get a bad rap these days especially with the arrival of more performant alternatives like React Native.

I avoid installing apps for most sites, but I kind of remember in the early days, anyway, people were just sneaking a Web view in there for most of the functionality in many apps.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#554

Post by floatingatoll »

obmelvin wrote: post #532
bb88 wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My only complaint is that if the mac were truly a developer-centric device, I wouldn't need homebrew to install software. It should just be in the apple store for me to download.

I could see an argument that Apple should make a tool like Homebrew themselves or official support Homebrew development (maybe they do, haven't looked), but including it in the app store would just be confusing. Plus, I can type 'brew install ' far faster than I could type into the search bar and make the necessary clicks to install.

That same argument extends to the users of Homebrew who are overflowing with cash from startup get-rich moments: please consider funding (if you have $1/mo or more to spare) the Homebrew patreon, which currently lists a total of 285 paying users out of the million developers that depend on it to earn a paycheck every month.

https://www.patreon.com/homebrew

(I do not participate in Homebrew other than as a user.)

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#555

Post by matwood »

deathanatos wrote: post #461
npunt wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2/3s of all PR activity on Github is on a Mac, for what it's worth. Certainly the platform punches above its weight relative to market share. https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/102/?time=2...

My last couple of jobs have given me no choice aside from a MBP and OS X. They do this because they don't want to manage multiple kinds of machines from an IT perspective. (I'm not sure I agree with this, but it is what it is.) Depending on how widespread this is, usage may not reflect actual user desire (though I would wager quite a large number of users either don't care what they're using, or care, but a MBP is ad…

> My last couple of jobs have given me no choice aside from a MBP and OS X. They do this because they don't want to manage multiple kinds of machines from an IT perspective.

This is a huge improvement over when I started developing and was forced to use Windows.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#556

Post by Someone »

throwaway2048 wrote: post #474
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Creatives who want hardware optimized Adobe apps to continue to be fast will care. I wouldn't count on emulation of vectorized code to work all that well.

emulating x86 on ARM with any kind of real preformanceis additionally tricky because the x86 archetechure has very strong memory gaurentees (dosent matter if memory is aligned, dosent matter when in the instruction pipeline you access it, etc) that ARM isnt even close to matching. Emulating that requires a massive performance hit, because you essentially have to check every single memory access to make sure its not d…

…or you design your own ARM CPU that handles unaligned memory accesses fine, and run your emulator on that hardware.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#557

Post by KajMagnus »

davidy123 wrote: post #437
mark_l_watson wrote: post #229

This might just be a bargaining move on Apple’s part, but I don’t think so. I think that long term they are much better off controlling their entire hardware stack. I wouldn’t be surprised to even see them make their own display screens. As an Apple customer, I like this idea also. For 20 years, I used to be a desktop Linux fanatic and later became a fan of Android. In the last few years, I have switched to using all…

You can't easily share media between the Apple ecosystem and others. You can't access some Apple services at all from Linux. There's no way to run userscripts/WebExtensions on IOS. Your device is no longer a user-focused tool to access media, your browser is closer to being a "smart tv" than a customize-able information explorer and augmenter essentially controlled by no one. You're giving up an awful lot for the sak…

> what's missing from a modern Linux desktop

Networking, printer stuff, graphics stuff that works immediately after installation, without one having to search for various problems & fixes on the Internet. And that doesn't randomly break after kernel upgrades.

Because of running into networking & graphics driver problems every now and then (and having to revert to older kernel versions), and problems with printers & drivers, I feel I would never never never recommend Linux to people, unless they enjoy troubleshooting things and learning new stuff.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#558

Post by bonestamp2 »

bb88 wrote: post #516
npunt wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2/3s of all PR activity on Github is on a Mac, for what it's worth. Certainly the platform punches above its weight relative to market share. https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/102/?time=2...

My only complaint is that if the mac were truly a developer-centric device, I wouldn't need homebrew to install software. It should just be in the apple store for me to download.

It's not a developer-centric OS and it's not supposed to be. But, that doesn't change the fact that a lot of developers prefer it over other OSs. I prefer because it has been more reliable for me than Windows. It's not right for everyone though and I completely understand anyone who prefers Windows or Linux.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#559

Post by rootusrootus »

bjoli wrote: post #453
sreque wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a software developer, and I detest working on my mac laptop. At $lastjob I had a Linux desktop and it is, I believe, the most productive environment I have ever developed in. The job before, I had a windows desktop, and I prefer that to mac. You say you want to just "get things done expediently," but in my experience apple software is flat out inferior and OSX is the worst of the 3 major operating systems I have…

I have long said that Mac os X is only useful as a way to start Emacs, but since 10.10 I am not even sure about that. Of course it is a matter of taste. I get that. I still have to bite my tongue to not yell profanities whenever I hear anything about productivity and Mac OS. Most of the time I keep my mouth shut. Now I just wanted to tell you that you are not alone. I have to use Mac OS at work. To avoid frustration…

I don't suppose it's any consolation, but I feel the same way if I have to use Linux or Windows as a workstation. Different strokes for different folks.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#560

Post by blacklight »

I personally hate close fences with no rooms for customization, and many computer scientists are on the same wavelength.

Windows is an awful choice for software development, a job that usually requires a lot of interaction with Unix servers. Microsoft's recent crush for Linux and open source can't fix many years of closed standards, closed protocols, and Embrace-Extend-Exterminate evil culture.

And MacOS, even though it's still loosely based on a Unix *BSD flavor, still falls into the "closed fence" category - brew is nice but can't be compared with the maturity of the package managers on any Linux distro, you can't just recompile or update the kernel on the fly to get support for a new device, and OS internals are purposely obscure to developers. Paying all that money for such a closed box, if you're anything more than an average users, is simply a waste of money.

Linux distros are by far the best environment for a computer scientists - made by developers, for developers - but there's no major vendor that sells machines with Linux pre-installed and supported, and getting Linux installed on the newest Surface or Dell toy is often a challenge that gets many frustrated.

There's definitely a huge gap in the market, and as a computer scientist I feel that none of the major vendors cares to provide me with a solid machine to do my work.

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