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Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

bloomberg.com

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Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#131

This is such an obvious move, that I predicted it 2 years ago: https://medium.com/@Jernfrost/in-3-years-apple-will-switch-f... My prediction in 2016, was that Apple would switch to ARM based laptops in 2019, so it looks like I am off by just 1 year. A quick summary of my argument back then was that ARM was getting fast ENOUGH, but are considerably cheaper. Standardizing on one CPU architecture for all their products…

What if it turns out not to be based on the ARM architecture?

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#132

Based on this article, it doesn't sound like Bloomberg has enough information to distinguish between Apple being committed to a transition, or Apple developing chips to improve their negotiating position with Intel. It's also very unlikely to happen on such a fast timetable; given the IP situation, it's unlikely Apple could make an x86_64 chip, and any move away from x86_64 is going to require significant work by thi…

> It's also very unlikely to happen on such a fast timetable the article (thin as it is) claims a multi-step transition. Apple almost certainly has a version of Mac OS that can run on their iPad hardware - the transition path that makes the most sense to me is a 12" MacBook that runs essentially the same internal hardware as an iPad pro, and a MacOS that can run iOS apps. There would be a great consumer market for a…

I’m still very skeptical of the “Mac that can run iOS apps” concept. Tim Cook has been pretty unambiguous in his statements about Mac vs iPad.

https://www.macrumors.com/2015/11/16/tim-cook-no-converged-m...

>We feel strongly that customers are not really looking for a converged Mac and iPad, because what that would wind up doing, or what we’re worried would happen, is that neither experience would be as good as the customer wants. So we want to make the best tablet in the world and the best Mac in the world. And putting those two together would not achieve either. You’d begin to compromise in different ways.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe a trackpad with a screen behind it. Apple already has an A series chip running the touchbar. Why not an iPhone under the trackpad?

I believe it's a T series, though your point still stands. I think I'd personally far prefer a display under the trackpad (though I don't think it's necessary at all) to a TouchBar or a touchscreen laptop. But I think I'm very much in the minority.

You are right, T-series.

I'd join you in that minority.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#134
About time. I'm tired of Intel's minimally viable laptop processors (and their security blunders). Apple has the margins and the volume to throw a lot of transistors at a problem, like they do in iOS devices. I want 13" Macbook with more than 2 cores, good GPU, and decent memory bandwidth. Apple can do big/little cores, large caches, wider memory buses (HBM please), inference acceleration, 120hz variable refresh with good battery life, etc. These things have a questionable ROI for Intel but set Apple apart and sell more hardware.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#135
post #69

Tim Cook has repeatedly stated that the iPad is "the clearest expression of our vision of the future of personal computing" and Apple only sells around 4M Macs per quarter, while iOS devices dwarf this stat. If their plan is to continue moving users from desktop/laptop devices to their iOS ecosystem, and the software can be transformed to cross between both classes of devices, then it only makes sense to unify the pr…

I can't take that seriously without them demonstrating an equal amount of work on the software end of the iPad. I am a huge believer in the potential of the iPad -- I was blown away by the original iWork and even more so by Garage Band, they both demonstrated honest attempts at providing differentiation from the desktop computing model. But then they just kind of ... stopped developing the OS and associated apps. We all forgave them for making iPad iOS just a bigger iPhone iOS at first because they were otherwise firing on all cylinders, but then they proceeded to continue ignoring this OS for over 5 years, only now providing what is in my opinion the absolute bare minimum features to make working on the iPad tolerable (multi-tasking, etc.)

It appears that Apple, at least when it comes to the iPad, is increasingly unwilling to deliver new software that isn't explicitly tied to a new piece of hardware (and thus a hardware sale). We got writing APIs in order to sell $99 Apple Pencils, but never an actual vision for what it would really mean to do professional work on the iPad. And at some point, it stops seeming like there's some master plan waiting to be unveiled just around the corner. The iPad has been around for 8 years and the fundamentals of using one have largely remained the same, the same as the original subpar experience we excused since it was obviously a 1.0 product. The iPad has basically gotten thinner, faster, and gotten a pencil (which don't get me wrong, is great). iPad sales reflect this: iOS DEVICES may be doing amazing, but iPad sales have plateaued or declined repeatedly. Apple seems eternally confused by this, as if they think the product is done. They begrudgingly offer a "new" iPad with older parts and slightly cheaper price as if people just don't get what they're missing.

But what's missing is a message, a message other than "this is obviously the next iteration of the computer, why aren't you buying them even though we hardly update the Mac either?". The message and vision would inspire Apple to lead by example in the software they produce for it.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#136

Based on this article, it doesn't sound like Bloomberg has enough information to distinguish between Apple being committed to a transition, or Apple developing chips to improve their negotiating position with Intel. It's also very unlikely to happen on such a fast timetable; given the IP situation, it's unlikely Apple could make an x86_64 chip, and any move away from x86_64 is going to require significant work by thi…

> It's also very unlikely to happen on such a fast timetable the article (thin as it is) claims a multi-step transition. Apple almost certainly has a version of Mac OS that can run on their iPad hardware - the transition path that makes the most sense to me is a 12" MacBook that runs essentially the same internal hardware as an iPad pro, and a MacOS that can run iOS apps. There would be a great consumer market for a…

Apple is rumored to allow iOS 12 apps to run on x86 macOS, with support for both touch and mouse interfaces.

https://www.macrumors.com/2018/01/31/apple-still-plans-combi...

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#137

This is such an obvious move, that I predicted it 2 years ago: https://medium.com/@Jernfrost/in-3-years-apple-will-switch-f... My prediction in 2016, was that Apple would switch to ARM based laptops in 2019, so it looks like I am off by just 1 year. A quick summary of my argument back then was that ARM was getting fast ENOUGH, but are considerably cheaper. Standardizing on one CPU architecture for all their products…

What if it turns out not to be based on the ARM architecture?

What else is there?

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#138
post #27

Great, we can go back to the macrumors nonsense about how this PPC is "just as fast" as the x86 days. With their focus on iOS vs MacOS, this doesn't surprise me. MacOS will simply die once they port their tools to iOS. Terrible choice IMO.

Except PPC was Motorola and IBM, not Apple

Aww, young'uns.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PowerPC

PowerPC (with the backronym Performance Optimization With Enhanced RISC – Performance Computing, sometimes abbreviated as PPC) is a reduced instruction set computing (RISC) instruction set architecture (ISA) created by the 1991 Apple–IBM–Motorola alliance, known as AIM. PowerPC, as an evolving instruction set, has since 2006 been named Power ISA, while the old name lives on as a trademark for some implementations of Power Architecture-based processors.

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#139

Based on this article, it doesn't sound like Bloomberg has enough information to distinguish between Apple being committed to a transition, or Apple developing chips to improve their negotiating position with Intel. It's also very unlikely to happen on such a fast timetable; given the IP situation, it's unlikely Apple could make an x86_64 chip, and any move away from x86_64 is going to require significant work by thi…

It will obviously be an ARM transition not x86: https://medium.com/@Jernfrost/in-3-years-apple-will-switch-f...

What is so "obvious" about it?

Re: Apple Plans to Use Its Own Chips in Macs from 2020, Replacing Intel

#140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah. There are only three extant architectural license holders (Intel, AMD and VIA) and they're basically in a circular firing squad of patents. To make their own chips, they'd need to either license from an existing holder (which wouldn't let them tinker unless it was a partnership or they acquired the license) or they'd need to make something so incredibly great the other three would trip over themselves to use it…

If they wanted to go x86 they would just buy VIA? I think it will be aarch64

Without meaning to comment on whether it is likely or not, they could also easily buy AMD.

(Price tag would be in the ballpark of $15-20 billion, 3 months of income for Apple)

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