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Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

reuters.com

241–250 of 487 posts

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#241
Vast majority of projects don't need the complexity of a multi-master geographically distributed append-only immutable database with uncertain transaction finality because other, simpler and better understood solutions already exist. Vast majority of projects don't have to deal with the Byzantine Generals problem that makes it so difficult to create a permissionless distributed value transfer system like Bitcoin.

Right tool for the right job.

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has always been the longest valid chain though. If miners were to introduce double-spending transactions in a block, full nodes would--by default--reject the blocks, regardless of how much work the chain contains. This also highlights why miners don't control the network and never had.

I'm no expert so bear with me. My understanding is that the danger of miner control is not "double-spending" but making multiple spends and being able to pick the most favorable one after the fact. As a non-controller if you try to double-spend, you can't know which one of your attempted transactions will be recorded in the ledger and which will be rejected. As a 51% controlling miner, you can choose the 'correct' tr…

Double-spending just means spending the same output in multiple transactions--there are many ways to perform a double-spend attack. Your interpretation of a 51% attack is correct.

If it wasn't clear, my comment was referring to a double-spend that would result in an invalid block i.e. both transactions are on the same chain. I simply used an example to argue that it's always been the case that invalid chains are rejected by honest nodes.

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No but it certifies who has entered the info, right? That might be part of the solution here

And how do you know that's the actual person, or that such a person/entity exists?

Isn't that EXACTLY the problem solved by cryptography, ie I can reliably know that only supplier X could have signed the message with the public key of supplier X ?

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know. What about Git ? Errors happen, then you correct them, but you can see the error and its correction, and it's considered quite healthy, right?

I can go back and rewrite history pretty easily in Git.

my answer was not about discussing Git. I was saying that it seems healthy to have a system that tracks errors and corrections

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#245
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The delays have little to do with technology, and a lot to do with regulations and bureaucracy. Largely put in place to combat money laundering, fraud, terrorist financing, etc etc. Yes, there's some small banks that have horrible APIs and shoddy servers, but for most transfers the delays come down to things that if cryptocurrency were ever mainstreamed would be tacked onto it. That is why it takes time to get approv…

There is literally no place to tack on a middleman with nano/btc. Yes it will take some rethinking of how we combat what society conceives as improper use of funds.

So the people I have to go through to convert my crypto to real money aren't middlemen?

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#246
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure if you've spoken to any Bitcoin developers recently, but they'll tell you you're wrong and that it is the valid chain with the most work, not the chain with the most work. They'll then tell you what valid means. Some developers would agree with you though, like Gavin Andresen [0]. Either way, you end up with either centralized miners deciding the fate of the chain, or centralized developers deciding the…

That's the beauty of it. It does not matter what Blockstream says. The longest chain is Bitcoin.

> The longest chain is Bitcoin.

Useless pedantry that doesn't even map into real world use. The real world has shown your definition is incorrect.

Ethereum forked. Which ethereum fork is the "correct" one? Bitcoin forked. Which one is the correct one? Depends on who you ask...

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#247
post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By cryptocurrency standards, 2008 was any given Tuesday.

Trusting banks, not comparing crashes.

The problem in 2008 was the investment, not the deposit arm of banks.

Bitcoin has had problems with both the investment, and the deposit arms. Most ICOs are pure fraud, and i've lost count of the number of robbed exchanges.

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#248
post #7

It is interesting that even in an article like this that they still say things like "for all its potential, blockchain is still in its early days." It is sticking with the unfounded assumption that it will be a success in the future, if only it is given more time. In technological terms, it is old. Innumerable efforts have been attempted, yielding almost no fruit. At what point are the fundamental assumptions going t…

> In technological terms, it is old. No it's not. It took double entry accounting hundreds of years to spread around the world, why would you expect triple entry accounting to take over any faster? We already know it's going to succeed because it's objectively better by a very significant margin, but that doesn't mean it's not going to take decades to do so.

> It took double entry accounting hundreds of years to spread around the world, why would you expect triple entry accounting to take over any faster?

Here in modern times information moves orders of magnitude faster than when double entry accounting was invented.

By modern standards, blockchain is ancient and has yet to move beyond its current use as the world's greatest platform for financial fraud ever invented.

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#249
post #7

It is interesting that even in an article like this that they still say things like "for all its potential, blockchain is still in its early days." It is sticking with the unfounded assumption that it will be a success in the future, if only it is given more time. In technological terms, it is old. Innumerable efforts have been attempted, yielding almost no fruit. At what point are the fundamental assumptions going t…

> In technological terms, it is old.

Really? This doesn't seem true at all. I feel like it takes decades for many good ideas in tech to get traction, usually going through many, many failed iterations.

Re: Wall Street rethinks blockchain projects as euphoria meets reality

#250

> The project, which had successfully tested with startup Digital Asset Holdings (DA), was shelved because banks and other potential users believed the same results could be achieved more cheaply using current technology, he said. This is more or less the curse of the almighty blockchain; it's very hard to think of a plausible, actually useful, application which can't be accomplished far more cheaply and simply using…

It's really not hard to think of useful applications for blockchain. The problem HN has with blockchain is that a lot of HN users are the problem which decentralization solves. The basic startup monetization strategies these days revolve around centralizing user data and then collecting rent (usually in the form of ads) or centralizing transactions and then collecting a percentage. Decentralization is the antithesis…

But it is quite hard to think of a useful application for blockchain that isn't done better and cheaper by existing methods.
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