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To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

nytimes.com

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Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#151
That's really just basic habit loop -- trigger-action-reward -- that one needs to break by replacing action part with something different more useful. Pretty quickly one gets used to a new habit loop structure and the same old trigger now ignites some healthy action to receive the same old reward.

E.g. teeth-brushing habit: trigger - wake up, action - brush teeth, reward - freshness mint (or other) taste in your mouth. That's basically why a taste was added at all to a toothpaste -- to create a habit loop. Before that teeth-brushing powder/paste was tasteless and resulted in bad sales.

The same habit loop structure is used a lot to change bad habits or to integrate new habits in sports, military, etc. There is a very good book about it by Charles Duhigg:

"The Power of Habit: Why We Do What We Do in Life and Business"

https://www.amazon.com/Power-Habit-What-Life-Business/dp/081...

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people want to lose weight, the worse advice you can give them is to "exercise to lose weight". Exercise has little to no effect on losing weight. You have to exercise at such a level of intensity and duration to make any meaningful difference that most people can't or won't do it. Losing weight is almost entirely about what you eat. As I said in another post, I was a part time fitness instructor for 12 years and…

I would disagree on this point. Although I am not very experienced in exercising, from time to time I start to jog or go to the gym for a couple of months and the only reason I do this is to get into shape; losing the weight was always a part of it. After all, there is a reason why thousands and thousands of people go to the gym only to lose weight. I'm not saying that exercising is only for this and of course it bri…

You must be under 30.

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#153
post #6

Disclaimer: I am not a doctor and if you are suffering emotionally/mentally please seek professional help. ---- My anecdote: I used to frequently suffer from (undiagnosed) anxiety and depression. For about a year, I would respond to sudden anxiety by seeking comfort in various forms of isolation/depressed behavior (watch TV as a distraction, try to take a "nap", etc.). The most insidious thing about this was how it s…

I did this as well, and it does work well. At work, when I ever found myself thinking about checking reddit, facebook, etc, I would instead step aside and do pushups. It improves my productivity. Until I started getting criticism from others about doing push ups, it had worked well. I realized my depression/anxiety was external. Even when I moved, one of the bizarre things I encountered were people criticizing me for…

People feel guilty when they see other people doing stuff to improve themselves. Crabs in a Bucket.

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I drank probably 1L of diet soda a day while loosing 90 lbs over 6 months, necessary evil I say!

I can ditto this completely. I don't know what's up with those studies but calories in calories out worked for me while drinking tons of diet soft drink. Some of the time I was doing low carb. It should be noted however that even sugar free carbonated drinks are bad for your teeth.

Yeah thats what is keeping me off them now (plus I've been caffeine free for a month!)

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#156
post #45

The linked article seems to suggest that you can replace bad habits with arbitrary other habits. Maybe that's true, but I think it's best to change your situation so that the right choice is the easiest to make. I've discussed this in the context of transportation cycling at HN in the past: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16515129 > As a transportation cyclist, some people I know think I must have superhuman wil…

> I think it's best to change your situation so that the right choice is the easiest to make. Lowering the activation energy required to do cardio by getting my own treadmill in the living room really helped me get into the habit of doing cardio more regularly. Now instead of paying every month for a gym membership I rarely used, I end up doing a good 3-4 hours of light cardio every week, opportunistically, because i…

> Lowering the activation energy required

This is exactly the reason why I like working out at home instead of dressing up and taking the time to travel to the nearest gym. And well, coming back from it too. In the process, I've even worked on improving my form while only been using my body-weight and a stress rope, instead of ego lifting at the gym.

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#157
post #80

When training animals, particularly dogs, it's (I think) pretty well-known that redirecting to positive behaviors is much more effective than punishing unwanted behaviors (so much so that one could say "punishment does not work at all compared to redirecting to desired behaviors" without much exaggeration). i.e. when a dog chews on a sofa cushion, put a dog chew in their mouth or direct them to go get their toy or ch…

I do agree with your statement, but it's the idealistic approach and sometimes not effective at all. A big problem with the dogs (as observed in humans, too) is that if they don't see a leader in you, they are going to take this position over. I've had 4 dogs in my lifetime and I've tried different approaches with all of them, because they all had different characters, but one thing I did with all of them: I was stri…

I strongly disagree, and stand by my assertion. I've owned dogs all my life (and I've been both very bad and very good at training dogs, depending on which point in my life we're talking about).

I'm absolutely confident that redirection and positive reinforcement is better than punishment...again, so much better that you can accurately say "punishment does not work" without much exaggeration.

Being the leader and punishment are not at all the same thing. Punishment can actually have unintended consequences. If your dog is behaving badly to illicit attention, punishment is still attention. So, the punishment kinda becomes a reward, but it's mixed up with a bunch of fear and confusion in the dog. Now they have anxiety about you, and uncertainty about what the right behaviors are to get the response they desire (attention, affection, food, play, walk, whatever). I've seen so many neurotic dogs who've been made that way by punishment from their owners.

That said, there are ways to not reinforce behaviors (which also work for little humans). When a dog is acting out to illicit a response, the right action is not punishment, but nothing: Withdraw attention. Silently turn away from them, leave the room, stand up if you're sitting with them and they're trying to climb into your lap. This is the same principle as a time out for a child. It isn't "punishment" in the sense most people mean, but it is an effective deterrent to unwanted behavior.

But again, redirection to a behavior that can be rewarded is best. You can't do that until you've trained the dog with a few behaviors that they can be redirected to. Once a dog knows "look at me", "sit", "stay", "down", and "heel", you can solve just about any behavior problem quickly, and your relationship with the dog can always be one that is gentle and free of anxiety for the dog. Dogs desperately want to be good dogs; it's instinctual from tens of thousands of years living with humans. The only problem is they don't understand what "good" means to humans until you teach them, and most behavior problems are communication problems, not lack of punishment.

The notion of "alpha" among canines is so misunderstood by most people that it is kind of pointless to use it as a guiding principle in dog training. Your dogs are part of your pack, not your slaves; they'll do what is good for the pack willingly and happily, as long as they understand what that means.

Perhaps we're just using different terminology here, but when people say "punishment", I assume they mean loudly yelling "no!" at the least and at the worst a rolled up newspaper, or rubbing their nose in poop, a shock or choke collar, or throwing them out of the house, or whatever. I sometimes catch myself becoming frustrated and yelling...but, I have also observed that it does not achieve my goal with the dog, and I can see their confusion and discomfort. In those instances, I should think about how to better communicate with the dog, not double down and become more "strict".

I accidentally adopted a dog recently (long story, but he was an RV park dog whose primary caregiver went to the hospital for over a week during a snowstorm), and he had tons of bad habits from being basically feral. Never walked on a leash, wasn't house trained, etc. It took literally a few days before the neighbors who knew him before I adopted him started expressing shock about how well he was behaving. If you'd told me 20 years ago that a dog could learn to walk well on a leash, come on command, sit/stay on command, be house-trained, and all around be a pretty good dog, in about a week, I would have been incredulous. He may be smarter than average, but really, I've helped tons of friends fix their dog's neurosis. (I am beginning to sound like I'm pitching a dog training program on late-night TV, so I'll stop, but I'm serious. Nearly every dog owner I've ever known is doing it so wrong, and I wish I could fix all of their broken ideas because dogs deserve a good relationship with their people.)

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#158
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people want to lose weight, the worse advice you can give them is to "exercise to lose weight". Exercise has little to no effect on losing weight. You have to exercise at such a level of intensity and duration to make any meaningful difference that most people can't or won't do it. Losing weight is almost entirely about what you eat. As I said in another post, I was a part time fitness instructor for 12 years and…

Agreed, but there's an exception in my personal experience. If you start commuting by riding a bicycle, you can easily get 5-10 hours a week at around 70% max heart rate (average). Of course it's difficult to motivate yourself to start and to keep at it. If the distance is long, you probably can't completely change to riding in one go due to excess fatigue, and if it's short it won't be effective. And of course it wi…

I'm not arguing that it can't be done, just that someone who is over weight and deconditioned is not going to have the stamina to work out enough to make a significant difference in their weight.

How long did it take you to get in the kind of shape to do that?

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would disagree on this point. Although I am not very experienced in exercising, from time to time I start to jog or go to the gym for a couple of months and the only reason I do this is to get into shape; losing the weight was always a part of it. After all, there is a reason why thousands and thousands of people go to the gym only to lose weight. I'm not saying that exercising is only for this and of course it bri…

You must be under 30.

I don't know if your comment is in response to my post. But I'm 43. When I was teaching fitness and working out 10 hours a week, I was between 25 and 35. These days, between problems with my ankles (not related to working out too much) and exercise induced asthma, I can't do high impact cardio, but I do still have my strength - hence high resistance low impact exercises.

Re: To Change Habits, Try Replacement Instead

#160
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, isn't it individual for every person? Statistically speaking, no. Most people's physical response to food and exercise is almost exactly the same given the same inputs. There may be minor variations from person to person, but the variations aren't large enough to change the general advice. There are extreme exceptions, but those are natually extremely rare, and shouldn't be used to muddy the water. > Secondly…

I didn't exaggerate with a bar of chocolate, I've done that, not proud, but a huge fan of chocolate. I understand what you mean and most people might do exactly as you say, I don't argue with that. My argument is that it is possible to lose weight if you do sports, even if you lose a very small amount of weight, it is still losing the weight. I'm not trying to stubbornly prove my point here, I just feel that I've bee…

I hear you, and I understand your point. And you're right too. Exercise is a way to burn calories faster, there's no denying that. I've been coming down extra hard to emphasize my point. ;)

But just to be clear, because I'm not sure I've been completely understood either, and to answer your question "why we should deny the fact that sports also is one of the options"... I never lost weight at the gym in 20 years of going to the gym until I realized that sports is not a weight loss option for me personally. The reason is that our physiology compensates for excess calorie burn by making us hungrier, which is true for almost all humans & animals. If I don't track what I eat, then I will accidentally eat too much after I work out, just like I accidentally eat too much when I don't work out. I know that many, many people have the same problem. Once you see this, you realize that for many people, going the gym actually has nothing to do with the weight loss, even if they think is does. It's either a way to continue to eat 2k+ calories, or a way to get stronger, but only the intake control is what leads to weight loss. Without the intake control, the gym just leads to more intake and no weight for me, and for a lot of people.

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