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Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

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Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#161

Post by tlobes »

orbifold wrote: post #57

Ok, well this is just great. So Facebook has all my contacts from their aquisition of WhatsApp and even though I've never used any of their Apps or had an account with them, I'm pretty sure everyone I typically communicate with has the App and did not opt-out of this collection. So they get data on me for free that the police would need a court order to get. This kind of data retention has been highly controversial i…

Crazy thought. When a company with a ton of accumulated assets (data) craters, do the rules of bankruptcy and/or mitigating their losses to investors force them to just sell these assets outright?

This may not happen in the next few decades with the likes of Facebook, but imagine what kind of data that much smaller companies have that will just be sold off to the highest bidder, possibly de-anonymized to increase it's value. Does a user privacy contract hold any weight when a company is about to dissolve?

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#162

Post by robryan »

ConcernedCoder wrote: post #128
Gaelan wrote: post #5

The Facebook blog post includes this screenshot [0]. That's definitely an opt-in, although I could imagine a non-technical person clicking through it without reading the grey text. Better than nothing. [0]: https://fbnewsroomus.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/opt-in_scre...

I'd like to formally welcome everyone to the world of a/b test-driven development! Nice easy-to-read high-contrast giant-font headings that seem legit: "Text anyone in your phone!" - Yay! that's exactly what I want!!! Tricky hard-to-read low-contrast micro-font fine print that looks like way to much trouble to try to read, detailing what ACTUALLY happens when you're tricked into clicking the: One brightly-colored-onl…

The opt out button is also "Not Now" so they can hit you with this screen again and again until you accidently opt in or want to make it go away.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#163

Post by robryan »

iaml wrote: post #138
WA wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d argue the data arcchive one can download are incomplete. One, it’s missing Likes. Second, I never put my phone number in Facebook, but I know they have it, because at one time, it was pre-filled in the enable account recovery by phone -dialog. So what you can export isn’t the full story. The question however is: how do you prove that and really ask for ALL data they have on you?

Are you sure it's not your browser auto-fill?

Or just harvested out of a friends contacts who has the phone number and email address.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#164

Post by zodiac »

dredmorbius wrote: post #160
zodiac wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I totally agree! But first of all, the prompt shown in the article's screenshot was not hidden in a long ToS. Second of all, I agree that we should work towards solving the problem that overly-long ToSs represent. What I do not agree with is the assertion that, in the presence of an overlong-ToS, we allow people to click-through, then get outraged at the company for doing something they were allowed to do by the ToS.…

Tools which become ubiquitous or prerequisites for other services are not discretionary. Facebook is the Internet for many people, is required for authenticating by numerous services, and is how numerous groups and communities organise. As such, its terms and services as those of numerous other services, should be defined in a standard set of obligations, rights, and responsibilities, by law.

> Tools which become ubiquitous or prerequisites for other services are not discretionary...As such, its terms and services as those of numerous other services, should be defined in a standard set of obligations, rights, and responsibilities, by law.

I see this sentiment in some form a lot. Is there a name for this principle? Where does it come from? I don't in general agree with it - speaking generally, I think enforcing this principle is a way to solve some problems, but not the best way - and would be interested in discussions about the principle itself.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#165

Post by qwerty456127 »

pishpash wrote: post #67
acqq wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both Google and Apple should provide "middle" controls. Even if I grant the app "access" to my contacts, I want to be able to select "which" contacts and which fields. E.g. if I use whatsapp for 3 people out of my 100 contacts saved in my phone, I want to be able to give to whatsapp only the access to the phones of these 3 contacts. Others should be invisible for whatsapp, if I want so. And they should not get the ad…

There are rooted utilities that do this, or allow you to spew fake data at those apps. That is, if you could unlock your bootloader and install the software you want. You should really blame phone manufacturers/carriers and Congress for giving you the privilege of paying for a piece of locked hardware that you don't own. They're only loaning you a billboard, after all, so what do you expect? Personally I wouldn't put…

> nor do I ever acquire unlockable devices.

Do you mean non-unlockable?

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#166

Post by aje403 »

adventured wrote: post #155
mk89 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait until GDPR is here, then we might discuss about it. I really wonder how they will pass all those "privacy checks".

It doesn't matter. They have the money, people and time to throw at compliance. GDPR won't dent Facebook in the least. They'll bend where they have to, and no further. They'll pay occasional fines and that won't matter either. If you take it to an extreme and the only thing they can do is show non-personalized advertising and do zero tracking, they'll still print billions in profit in the EU market. That's what ownin…

Please stop, what you’re saying is too accurate. Could you potentially edit some pitchforks and such into your comment?

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#167

Post by WA »

iaml wrote: post #138
WA wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d argue the data arcchive one can download are incomplete. One, it’s missing Likes. Second, I never put my phone number in Facebook, but I know they have it, because at one time, it was pre-filled in the enable account recovery by phone -dialog. So what you can export isn’t the full story. The question however is: how do you prove that and really ask for ALL data they have on you?

Are you sure it's not your browser auto-fill?

Yes, I’m sure, because I deactivated that and because they’ve shown me 2-3 different numbers over time for whatever reason.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#168

Post by HenryBemis »

adventured wrote: post #155
mk89 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait until GDPR is here, then we might discuss about it. I really wonder how they will pass all those "privacy checks".

It doesn't matter. They have the money, people and time to throw at compliance. GDPR won't dent Facebook in the least. They'll bend where they have to, and no further. They'll pay occasional fines and that won't matter either. If you take it to an extreme and the only thing they can do is show non-personalized advertising and do zero tracking, they'll still print billions in profit in the EU market. That's what ownin…

"occasional fines"?

Living in EU, and I am thrilled at the party we will have, when 1-2 million people/facebook users will send this letter to FB [1]. I strongly believe that this will hurt them financially (where it actually matters/hurts).

I (try to) sinkhole every tracker, advertiser etc. on my PC and jailbroken iphone. I am sure that I don't block every one, but 90% is better than 0%.

It may keep me busy, but when I start receiving the answers that FB, Amazon, etc. have provided my data to XYZ broker, and then I will be more thrilled when I send THOSE guys the same letter.

Of course after every inquiry they will be receiving a "right to be forgotten" letter.

Hurt them where it does until they learn to respect people and not see them as items to be traded.

[1]: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/nightmare-letter-subject-acce...

Ps: I am not a hater. I enjoyed FB until it started to try to manipulate me e.g. altering my timeline and showing me what THEY deemed is 'good for me' (profitable for them).

Pps: They make enough from advertising. It was excessive greed that got them to start the sell-out.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#169

Post by krick »

jobigoud wrote: post #112
anilakar wrote: post #83

I suspected this many years ago when familiar faces from our customers started to appear in the friend suggestion box. I've never installed the FB app on my phone, but our less privacy oriented customers probably have. What pisses me off is that while I can choose what information I share, I haven't given other people nor Facebook permission to read phone call logs that involve me.

The worst part is that they probably suggested these various customers to befriend themselves, just because they all had you in their contact list. Scenarios like these have been reported with unrelated patients of medical professionals.

Wow. I just imagined working as a sales agent or something like this, and how much trouble could Facebook cause me in this case. Even for somebody, who always felt some disdain for Facebook, this is quite mindblowing.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#170

Post by WA »

robryan wrote: post #163
iaml wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure it's not your browser auto-fill?

Or just harvested out of a friends contacts who has the phone number and email address.

Exactly. My point is: FB has way more data about me than the download archive of my data contains/suggests.
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