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Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

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Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#51

Post by mulmen »

shiado wrote: post #49

Hopefully with all these recent transgressions against digital rights we will see the emergence of some hybrid of Zeronet, TOR, I2P, IPFS, BitTorrent, etc... All these technologies have some serious usability/UX problems. We need something so easy to use and so ubiquitous that it will make nations feel like Metallica going up against Napster.

From my perspective this is a legislative issue and not a technology problem. The solution here is still to participate in democracy and preserve our rights.

How will putting the government on the defensive result in better lawmaking? That’s exactly the situation we are in now. Lawmakers are afraid of technology and make ill advised laws to try and control it.

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#52

Post by jakeogh »

syshum wrote: post #20
dragonwriter wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This could be an excellent use of the Presidential veto. It would be insanity for the President to veto a spending bill needed to avert a shutdown because it included a provision the Administration has publicly supported and actively sought. > Whatever your political leanings, omnibus bills are a terrible outcome Omnibus spending bills are fine — the particular financial provisions of any one may be good or bad, bu…

>but the concept is fine; they are a completely sensible way to set government finances rather than doing it piecemeal. No they are not fine, not has they are used today. Congress as normal has abused the power of these bill this being a prime example. This is why we need a Constitutional Amendment to bring the US Constitution in line with 41 US States where the Single Subject Rule is enforced. We also need to bring…

The line item veto will never be back, it should never have happened. Congress writes laws, not the executive. I'm with you on the rest of that.

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#53

Post by edaemon »

tzs wrote: post #48
kyrra wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which he is considering doing right now. https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/97716688749379993... "I am considering a VETO of the Omnibus Spending Bill based on the fact that the 800,000 plus DACA recipients have been totally abandoned by the Democrats (not even mentioned in Bill) and the BORDER WALL, which is desperately needed for our National Defense, is not fully funded." (edit: updated link to Trump's twi…

> "I am considering a VETO of the Omnibus Spending Bill based on the fact that the 800,000 plus DACA recipients have been totally abandoned by the Democrats (not even mentioned in Bill) and the BORDER WALL [...] Can someone explain to me how Congress cannot get DACA handled? The last polling I saw showed that it had near universal support among Democrats, and a solid majority among Republicans (about 80% overall for…

DACA is the executive policy while the DREAM Act is the bill that Congress has yet to handle. Congress hasn't dealt with it because the Republican party was using it as a bargaining chip in the budget negotiations -- their voters see other issues as more important than DACA/DREAM while the Democrats want it passed.

The Trump administration made it a pressing matter in the negotiations by rescinding DACA in September 2017, but over the following months various District Court cases were filed and the judges ordered the government to continue the DACA policy. The administration tried to appeal those findings directly in the Supreme Court -- bypassing the appeals courts -- but it was unanimously rejected, effectively upholding the lower courts' rulings for now.

Since DACA is no longer under existential threat the Democrats have backed off of the DREAM Act in order to get other priorities through, and the Republicans are happy to let sleeping dogs lie.

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#54

Post by cryoshon »

mulmen wrote: post #51
shiado wrote: post #49

Hopefully with all these recent transgressions against digital rights we will see the emergence of some hybrid of Zeronet, TOR, I2P, IPFS, BitTorrent, etc... All these technologies have some serious usability/UX problems. We need something so easy to use and so ubiquitous that it will make nations feel like Metallica going up against Napster.

From my perspective this is a legislative issue and not a technology problem. The solution here is still to participate in democracy and preserve our rights. How will putting the government on the defensive result in better lawmaking? That’s exactly the situation we are in now. Lawmakers are afraid of technology and make ill advised laws to try and control it.

>implying they listen to us and not the people who have money

you should know better than that by now, come on. vote, do whatever. i sure do. but until you're disrupting things, they won't listen.

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#55

Post by [deleted] »

syshum wrote: post #20
dragonwriter wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This could be an excellent use of the Presidential veto. It would be insanity for the President to veto a spending bill needed to avert a shutdown because it included a provision the Administration has publicly supported and actively sought. > Whatever your political leanings, omnibus bills are a terrible outcome Omnibus spending bills are fine — the particular financial provisions of any one may be good or bad, bu…

>but the concept is fine; they are a completely sensible way to set government finances rather than doing it piecemeal. No they are not fine, not has they are used today. Congress as normal has abused the power of these bill this being a prime example. This is why we need a Constitutional Amendment to bring the US Constitution in line with 41 US States where the Single Subject Rule is enforced. We also need to bring…

[deleted]

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#56

Post by syshum »

jakeogh wrote: post #52
syshum wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but the concept is fine; they are a completely sensible way to set government finances rather than doing it piecemeal. No they are not fine, not has they are used today. Congress as normal has abused the power of these bill this being a prime example. This is why we need a Constitutional Amendment to bring the US Constitution in line with 41 US States where the Single Subject Rule is enforced. We also need to bring…

The line item veto will never be back, it should never have happened. Congress writes laws, not the executive. I'm with you on the rest of that.

>>Congress writes laws, not the executive

and the executive approves them, that is the check. If they created a Single Issue rule it would not be an issue anyway, but if they are going to have the ability to pass omnibus bills then a check on that is the line item veto, no line item veto not omnibus they should go hand in hand

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#57

Post by jakeogh »

syshum wrote: post #56
jakeogh wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The line item veto will never be back, it should never have happened. Congress writes laws, not the executive. I'm with you on the rest of that.

>>Congress writes laws, not the executive and the executive approves them, that is the check. If they created a Single Issue rule it would not be an issue anyway, but if they are going to have the ability to pass omnibus bills then a check on that is the line item veto, no line item veto not omnibus they should go hand in hand

It changes the meaning of the law as written.

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#58

Post by zdkl »

AFNobody wrote: post #42
drawkbox wrote: post #23

> This bill is the CLOUD Act. It was never reviewed or marked up by any committee in either the House or the Senate. It never received a hearing. It was robbed of a stand-alone floor vote because Congressional leadership decided, behind closed doors, to attach this un-vetted, unrelated data bill to the $1.3 trillion government spending bill. Congress has a professional responsibility to listen to the American people’…

Yup. No secret, once recorded, stays secret forever and the surveillance state's expansion is making it worse. It'll just be a bigger pot to steal and no one bothers to pay for security because they don't have to. Equifax made money off its security breach ffs.

>Equifax made money off its security breach ffs.

Source?

Re: Responsibility Deflected, the CLOUD Act Passes

#59

Post by Consultant32452 »

tzs wrote: post #48
kyrra wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which he is considering doing right now. https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/97716688749379993... "I am considering a VETO of the Omnibus Spending Bill based on the fact that the 800,000 plus DACA recipients have been totally abandoned by the Democrats (not even mentioned in Bill) and the BORDER WALL, which is desperately needed for our National Defense, is not fully funded." (edit: updated link to Trump's twi…

> "I am considering a VETO of the Omnibus Spending Bill based on the fact that the 800,000 plus DACA recipients have been totally abandoned by the Democrats (not even mentioned in Bill) and the BORDER WALL [...] Can someone explain to me how Congress cannot get DACA handled? The last polling I saw showed that it had near universal support among Democrats, and a solid majority among Republicans (about 80% overall for…

It doesn't serve either party's interests to actually "solve" anything regarding immigration policy. It's far more valuable to keep it as a hot button issue to virtue signal over in order to garner votes.
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