Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA • Hacker News Board

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#71

Post by blattimwind » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:35 AM UTC

seibelj wrote: post #3

Obviously driving prostitution underground and out of reach of researchers will improve the lives of sex workers. Prostitution is a very recent industry and was invented by the internet

> Prostitution is a very recent industry and was invented by the internet

This statement ranks fairly high up on my "List of Hackernews' Statements that are indeed Very False".

It would be more apt to say that regulating and banning prostitution is a recent idea (recent as in "the last 100 years or so").

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#72

Post by rpearl » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:38 AM UTC

quotemstr wrote: post #68

I am fucking sick and fucking tired of people interfering with the free choice of individuals in any effort to "fix" society and "help" people. Lawmakers and advocates, have some epistemic humility and acknowledge that your own perspective may be mistaken. Not everything is oppression. Not every activity is injustice. Sometimes, people just fucking disagree.

The goal of the legislation in question is specifically to help individuals that have been coerced, against their free will, into sex trafficking.

It is not about voluntary interactions between consenting adults.

The legislation might be misguided or ineffective--I haven't really looked into it--but it very definitely isn't about restricting the free choice of individuals.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#73

Post by always_good » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:39 AM UTC

blattimwind wrote: post #71

seibelj wrote: post #3

Obviously driving prostitution underground and out of reach of researchers will improve the lives of sex workers. Prostitution is a very recent industry and was invented by the internet

> Prostitution is a very recent industry and was invented by the internet This statement ranks fairly high up on my "List of Hackernews' Statements that are indeed Very False". It would be more apt to say that regulating and banning prostitution is a recent idea (recent as in "the last 100 years or so").

Both of their sentences were meant sarcastically.

I think people often use sarcasm to trot out trite topics because it seems less labored than restating such a popular point of view in earnest.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#74

Post by dahdum » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:39 AM UTC

dahdum wrote: post #51

post_break wrote: post #6

How soon will reddit follow? The great purge has started. Guns removed from YouTube and reddit. Now meet up portions are being nuked.

They’ve already started banning all the subs about escorts, prostitution, sugar daddies, etcetera today in response. Also subs like BeerTrade, BazaarMarkets , and other marketplaces. Say goodbye to an era. I’m sure many more will get the axe over time.

I do wonder how long until they start banning amateur porn subs like gonewild, they facilitate cam girl advertising there with no controls for age or trafficking status.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#75

Post by valuearb » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:44 AM UTC

rpearl wrote: post #72

quotemstr wrote: post #68

I am fucking sick and fucking tired of people interfering with the free choice of individuals in any effort to "fix" society and "help" people. Lawmakers and advocates, have some epistemic humility and acknowledge that your own perspective may be mistaken. Not everything is oppression. Not every activity is injustice. Sometimes, people just fucking disagree.

The goal of the legislation in question is specifically to help individuals that have been coerced, against their free will, into sex trafficking. It is not about voluntary interactions between consenting adults. The legislation might be misguided or ineffective--I haven't really looked into it--but it very definitely isn't about restricting the free choice of individuals.

It’s completely limiting free choice and voluntary interactions between consenting adults. A huge personals section just got shut down. Unless you think 100% of personal ads are coerced sex trafficking, which would be rather crazy opinion.

If you truly wanted to curb sex trafficking, you’d legalize prostitution, not drive it farther underground.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#76

Post by abritinthebay » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:44 AM UTC

extralego wrote: post #54

It seems this and the new Youtube/Reddit bans would push more of this communication to the dark web and/or other private communication channels. I don't think I am comfortable with that. But, hopefully it leads to more support and push for privacy and decentralization. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-21/youtube-b... https://motherboard.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/ne9v5k/reddit...

There is something to be said for making a discouraged activity harder to do.

Yes, it pushes these people underground but in a sense that is good as it makes it harder for them and harder to access them. In return it’s not much harder for authorities to infiltrate and there’s less non-illicit activity to filter.

Not perfect, but it’s not always bad.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#77

Post by narrator » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:45 AM UTC

remailer404 wrote: post #18

Wow! I met my wife just over 7 years ago there, and our 2nd kid is due in a few months. Hard to believe that the personals section is gone.

Since I'm a relatively old guy, I'll tell you how it used to work. Before cell phones, online dating and apps, the way people met people was through friends, or at work, or god forbid, randomly approaching a stranger and introducing oneself, usually at a nightclub or bar, but sometimes at a supermarket or cafe. Rejection happened in one's face publicly in front of other people!

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#78

Post by blattimwind » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:45 AM UTC

always_good wrote: post #73

blattimwind wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Prostitution is a very recent industry and was invented by the internet This statement ranks fairly high up on my "List of Hackernews' Statements that are indeed Very False". It would be more apt to say that regulating and banning prostitution is a recent idea (recent as in "the last 100 years or so").

Both of their sentences were meant sarcastically. I think people often use sarcasm to trot out trite topics because it seems less labored than restating such a popular point of view in earnest.

Oh well, not sure how I failed to pick up on that. I'll just blame it on the early hour and be on my way.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#79

Post by abritinthebay » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:45 AM UTC

thrden wrote: post #48

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #21

This is completely bizarre, we can't go down this route with the internet. It is madness.

Unfortunately we've had a very poor week for internet freedom. However much of it has been the result of corporate overreach. This week: Reddit bans Cigar, beer and Alchohol trading subreddits, toy bb gun sales, and gun related coupon clippers Youtube (and facebook?) banned Channels featuring guns they deem inappropriate. Including videos regarding proper safety and maintenance. It has become clear to be that the int…

What about the “internet freedom” of those sites to tell people they don’t want to go away?

This legislation isn’t that but your examples are.

Re: Craigslist takes personals sections offline in response to FOSTA

#80

Post by abritinthebay » Fri, Mar 23, 2018, 5:46 AM UTC

pishpash wrote: post #27

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #21

This is completely bizarre, we can't go down this route with the internet. It is madness.

The internet is not "the internet" any more. It's a corporate owned, tapped and monitored, centralized data warehouse. Another decentralized network needs to be formed separately adhering to the original ideals of the internet. In fact this turnover may need to happen periodically. Jump ship from the current so-called internet.

It’s been that for about 20 years, roughly.