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Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

theguardian.com

11–20 of 119 posts

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#11
That's sad, but until we get insecticides with high specificity I'd rather have fewer birds and fewer insects over more birds and more insects.

Monocultures are definitely in need of becoming at least somewhat diversified because besides the birds, right now we're still at a point where a stupid plant virus or fungus can kill millions because it can wipe out half of the world's wheat or rice production.

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#12
post #5

GMO anyone?

The purpose of many GMO plants is to be more resilient against pesticides.

The GMO plant itself isn't what kills the insects which than poison the birds.. it's the poison that's sprayed on the plants.

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#13
post #8
post #5

GMO anyone?

Somehow I don’t see domesticated plants killing off insects. Monocultures, maybe. Why not pesticides?

What do you mean by domesticated? It's very vague.

The original comment looks shallow at first, but GMOs often contain pesticides inside the seed/grain because the companies designing them don't know how to control it. That could potentially harm birds in the long run, and definitely harms insects.

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#15
post #5

GMO anyone?

The purpose of many GMO plants is to be more resilient against pesticides. The GMO plant itself isn't what kills the insects which than poison the birds.. it's the poison that's sprayed on the plants.

> The GMO plant itself isn't what kills the insects

https://entomology.ca.uky.edu/ef130

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#16
Possible contributing cause is a class of insecticides called neonicotinoids. These are not sprayed, but rather coated on seeds, arguably even more alarming.

    Seed coating with a neonicotinoid insecticide negatively affects wild bees
        https://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v521/n7550/full/nature14420.html

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#18
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purpose of many GMO plants is to be more resilient against pesticides. The GMO plant itself isn't what kills the insects which than poison the birds.. it's the poison that's sprayed on the plants.

> The GMO plant itself isn't what kills the insects https://entomology.ca.uky.edu/ef130

Wow interesting, thank you.

  Bt Delta Endotoxin
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipopolysaccharide#Health_effe...

an interesting side note, endotoxin test have relied on availability of horseshoe crab blood:

  The standard assay for detecting presence of endotoxin is 
  the Limulus Amebocyte Lysate (LAL) assay, utilizing blood 
  from the Horseshoe crab (Limulus polyphemus).[44] Very low 
  levels of LPS can cause coagulation of the limulus lysate 
  due to a powerful amplification through an enzymatic 
  cascade. However, due to the dwindling population of 
  horseshoe crabs, and the fact that there are factors that 
  interfere with the LAL assay, efforts have been made to 
  develop alternative assays, with the most promising ones 
  being ELISA tests using a recombinant version of a protein 
  in the LAL assay, Factor C.[

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#19

Possible contributing cause is a class of insecticides called neonicotinoids. These are not sprayed, but rather coated on seeds, arguably even more alarming. Seed coating with a neonicotinoid insecticide negatively affects wild bees https://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v521/n7550/full/nature14420.html

With on the seed, there is a lot less neonicotinoid than in an area spray. I tend to prefer minimalist use versus area use.

Re: Bird populations in French countryside have fallen by a third in fifteen years

#20
post #2

I don't know of any studies to prove it is true, but I suspect that the US Midwest (in particular) has had a similar decline. Anecdotally I can say that there are certainly far fewer insects here than there were in the 60s and 70s when I was growing up, and also that there seem to be far fewer birds. I wonder if we'll stop dumping this stuff into the environment before it's too late. It would require a whole new way…

No there are not fewer birds. Ornithologists routinely census areas for species and counts. They notice when species decline in an area. They notice when new species arrive in an area. There have been zero reports of birds in general declining.

EDIT: Here's a reference [1]. Note that it specifically calls out species in general decline: the Northern Bobwhite, American Kestrel, and the Loggerhead Shrike.

[1] http://www.audubon.org/news/the-118th-annual-audubon-christm...

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