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WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

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Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#451

Post by specialist »

propman wrote: post #26

I don't get what changed? We've knows Facebook tracks everything, we've known Google does the same thing. If you've ever developed anything in messenger even today, it's amazing how much information is given. We know all these sites track everything you do outside of Facebook too. Everyone has been trying to get them to stop, we know it's illegal to build a profile on someone but Facebook gets around that by building…

Scandals don't matter until they do.

The bad stuff is an open secret. But people choose to discount the bad so long as it appears outweighed by the good. Eventually the grace period runs out. Voila: Scandal.

Also, scandals are manufactured distraction. There's no shortage of things to be upset about. What percolates up is governed by the politics of attention.

--

I can't quickly refind the Ellsberg paper about the structure of presidential scandals. But this one is close enough. Obviously, they study presidential scandals, but the lessons apply to all scandals.

The Timing of Presidential Scandals: The Role of Economics, Divided Government and the Media http://file.scirp.org/pdf/OJPS_2016012915363533.pdf

The Politics of Attention: How Government Prioritizes Problems http://a.co/dTmg3WC

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#452

Post by TarpitCarnivore »

danjayh wrote: post #58
propman wrote: post #26

I don't get what changed? We've knows Facebook tracks everything, we've known Google does the same thing. If you've ever developed anything in messenger even today, it's amazing how much information is given. We know all these sites track everything you do outside of Facebook too. Everyone has been trying to get them to stop, we know it's illegal to build a profile on someone but Facebook gets around that by building…

What's more, I suspect that if this exact same thing had been done by a company working for Obama's or Hillary's campaigns, nobody would have batted an eyelash. PS - the reason that the regs wont happen during the trump years has nothing to do with the collusion investigation. He's put a mandate in place that for every reg to go into the federal register, two have to come out. His administration is in general very an…

The big difference is that the Obama campaign didn't try to hide their intention of having you sign up with Facebook. The 'research' firm tricked people into thinking it was a research study when they were in fact harvesting data for different means.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#453

Post by pbhjpbhj »

qaq wrote: post #407
propman wrote: post #26

I don't get what changed? We've knows Facebook tracks everything, we've known Google does the same thing. If you've ever developed anything in messenger even today, it's amazing how much information is given. We know all these sites track everything you do outside of Facebook too. Everyone has been trying to get them to stop, we know it's illegal to build a profile on someone but Facebook gets around that by building…

One thing I am confused with all the data collection that is going on (and it obviously costing them $ and some reputational risks) is not really helping them to produce decent ad targeting. I am not even surprised by how bad FB ads are most of the time but even Amazon that has 20 years of my purchase history is amazingly bad: I already bought 4 Elixir programming books and looking to buy new books when they come out…

The Elixir strings people are paying to be in those search results presumably - even when you don't buy they're getting paid. Amazon's infective is to profit, that doesn't always assign with your desire to buy.

Also, they might find that people who aren't searching for what they're shown keep looking and that it didn't reduce purchases. It's like the supermarkets moving products around to make sure you see other stuff - people don't leave the store, they keep looking and get exposed to more products in unfamiliar positions that make them notice more.

I mean, heck, you just talked about a couple of products and gave a product endorsement because they didn't show the results you expected; seems like the system is working.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#454

Post by gadders »

jiggliemon wrote: post #87

All of this Facebook hubub and broad public outcry is really all owed to the election of Trump. If Trump handnt leveraged CA, we’d still all be happy and fat on out individual bliss boxes – patting ourselves on the back – because our side [a la Obama] was smart enough to use this technology to our advantage. Now when the enemy has (and use) the same technology, we’re forced to cry foul. Demand oversight. Demand regul…

Let's not forget that Facebook gave the Obama campaign privileged access to data because they agreed with them politically:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5520303/Obama-campai...

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#455

Post by pbhjpbhj »

JohnTClark wrote: post #338
propman wrote: post #26

I don't get what changed? We've knows Facebook tracks everything, we've known Google does the same thing. If you've ever developed anything in messenger even today, it's amazing how much information is given. We know all these sites track everything you do outside of Facebook too. Everyone has been trying to get them to stop, we know it's illegal to build a profile on someone but Facebook gets around that by building…

The thing is that now people see a real consequence of that data harvesting, like voting manipulation.

Do people realise they're being manipulated though?

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#456

Post by TarpitCarnivore »

fzeroracer wrote: post #161

So I want to cut off an argument at the pass here. Specifically: "Everyone knows Facebook already gathers all of your data." We, as people here both on HN and people in the tech world take for granted the fact that we both know and understand how our systems work (mostly). We know that companies package and sell our data, that if something is 'free' the real subscription fee is what they collect on us during each use…

To add onto this, I believe a large amount of consumers of these products assumed they were only accessing their own data. This story is highlighting how these companies further connect dots between you _and_ all your connections. This is where I feel people didn't recognize the larger scale of all of this, especially with progmatic programming for ads. Any time you try to outline how ad networks work w/r/t to "FB is recording us" you're met with "yeah buts". I think a lot of people didn't want to believe this was possible, but now have no choice but to accept it is very much happening.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#457

Post by gadders »

wnevets wrote: post #327
SlowRobotAhead wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Um... you can’t say “whataboutism” when you are comparing two directly hypocritical reactions to the same scenario. CA sold data to Trump, Rubio, and others - pitchforks! FB gives data to Obama and Clinton, marketing awards and praise.

CA sold stolen data and bragged about blackmailing politicians. Gonna need a citation of Obama being even remotely involved in something like that. Classic deflection.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5520303/Obama-campai...

Story contains tweets from his campaign manager.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#458

Post by specialist »

thirdsun wrote: post #332
propman wrote: post #26

I don't get what changed? We've knows Facebook tracks everything, we've known Google does the same thing. If you've ever developed anything in messenger even today, it's amazing how much information is given. We know all these sites track everything you do outside of Facebook too. Everyone has been trying to get them to stop, we know it's illegal to build a profile on someone but Facebook gets around that by building…

To be honest I was not aware that Facebook invited anyone to take out that data merely asking them to delete it shortly after. That's the part that's new and offending to me. Meanwhile I tolerate political campaigns using targetted advertising. I just wish people were showing more competence when it comes to media consumption and the ability to distinguish between truthful reporting and obvious lies. The media illite…

It's not incompetence.

It's an exploit of our evolutionary psychology. Fake news, keep people spun up, etc. We've always known these things about ourselves.

"A lie is half-way around the world before the truth even gets its pants on" -- Mark Twain (probably)

Our susceptibility to manufactured outrage and refined sugars are the same thing. Former survival traits are being exploited for profit.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#459

Post by icebraining »

pvdebbe wrote: post #425
distant_hat wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They scan emails. I have had airline ticket reservations that my friends emailed to me added on my Calendar.

Yikes. That would prove it...

It's not exactly a secret: https://support.google.com/calendar/answer/6084018?co=GENIE....

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#460

Post by hycaria »

simonh wrote: post #445
hycaria wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't put that much data out, but I don't mind being profiled. I like being suggested music that I'm susceptible to like based on other people. I think it's fine if one can infer out of my lifestyle that I would be interested in x or warn for risks of y. What is wrong with it ? I'm probably no statistical anomaly, I don't mind being part of some artificial cluster somewhere, helping having a more accurate portrayal…

I was talking to my daughter about that yesterday. Suppose Facebook knows your interests, taste in music, where you live, what good you like, etc. A political campaign could use that information to tell you that their local candidate shares your interests, lived in the same town, loves the same music, supports the same charity or whatever overlaps with your profile, while knowingly avoiding telling you about things y…

I don't vote, I don't care. Couldn't care less about politics to be quite honest. They have a very marginal influence on my life, aspirations and happiness.
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