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Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

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281–290 of 402 posts

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#281
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was going 3mph over the speed limit, a perfectly reasonable speed that is still probably lower than almost everyone else on the road.

Serious question: how are speed limits enforced (or not) in the USA? From what I read on the internet, it seems like they are 90% unenforced, 10% arbitrarily enforced by cops who choose who they want to pull over from the masses who are routinely speeding. If they are mostly unenforced, how does the system work? Does everyone implicitly add 20% to the posted limit, or do they just go whatever speed feels right to the…

Part of the issue is that within large parts of the united states, speed limits are set at the 85%ile of the speed people drive [1] ... and in my experience, often are only enforced if the police suspect you of something else, or you are driving extremely aggressively (cutting people off, not safe stopping distance, etc.) because speeding is a far more cut-and-dry offense to prosecute, "reckless driving" may be easier to argue away in court due to the level of judgement required.

[1] https://usa.streetsblog.org/2012/11/16/one-for-the-dustbin-t...

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#282

Bloomberg title: >> Uber Victim Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Car First line of the first paragraph in the article (my underlining): >> Police say a video from the Uber self-driving car that struck and killed a woman on Sunday shows her moving in front of it suddenly And the title on this thread: >> Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber Both titles are very misleading. The Bloom…

Yes, this is a serious abuse of headline on both counts. Mods, can we change the title on HN? It’s a significant misrepresentation as it stands.

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why didn't the human hit the brake? I don't understand how this is even news to be honest. There was a human in the driving seat and he failed to stop just like the computer.

Computers have better reaction times than humans. Forcibly braking is a simple maneuver.

> Computers have better reaction times than humans. Forcibly braking is a simple maneuver.

The question isn't about the MHZ speed of a computer or the theoretical reaction time but the lack of reaction by the computer in the actual real world. It doesn't matter if this is a sensor failure, a software bug, or a slow reaction by a computer. The result is the same. A person died.

From the article:

*"... the lack of braking or swerving whatsoever is alarming and suggests that the system never anticipated the collision.”

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#284
post #157
post #75

Self-driving cars are still a fantasy. I don't want the AI to be comparable to an average driver (who collectively get into 6 million accidents) . I want the AI to meet/exceed the skills of the best driver. There is no way anyone would trust an "average" driver to pickup their kids, more than themselves.

I've been in plenty of cars driven by Uber/Lyft/Taxi drivers not to mention coworkers/friends/family who were decidedly below-average.

Well, I want my computer to be able to do perfect math, without mistakes too. Its one of the reasons people use computers to begin with !

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#286
post #44

The NYT just published a graphic that purports to show the location of the vehicle and the victim: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/03/20/us/self-drivi... This is the first report I've seen that indicates the Uber AV was in the right lane. Remember that the victim was crossing from left to right, and that all of the visible damage on the AV is on the right-side bumper. It's very hard to imagine a scenario in…

> The NYT just published a graphic that purports to show the location of the vehicle and the victim:

Emphasis on ”purports”. The NYT graphic doesn’t indicate the vehicle was in the right lane, nor does it indicate a precise location for Elaine. I don’t think you have bad intentions here, but extrapolating a hypothesis from this graphic seems unfounded.

There isn’t enough information to go on to develop reasonable hypotheses from any angle, unfortunately. The investigation needs to complete and footage needs to be released.

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#287
post #270

When I was getting my learners permit I was practicing on a curvy mountain road. I saw a person with a camera phone on the "drop off" side of the road, taking a picture of from what my angle would've been a boring cliff face. But I knew that a camera phone photographer was probably actually photographing a human, who would likely be on the other side of the blind corner. So I slowed down, despite my instructor chasti…

Should your driving instructor also not be on the road?

Probably not. But I also failed my first driving test for going to slow (I was within the minimum and maximum speed range, but new drivers going slow I guess is a sign of an unconfident driver).

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#288
post #268
post #6

Yes, the report you'd hope to be hearing from Uber is along the lines of "0.2 seconds after the pedestrian entered the travel lane the automated system identified her as a hazard and initiated an avoidance maneuver. Despite braking and beginning to swerve away, the car impacted the pedestrian 1.2 seconds later." Thats the promise the automated vehicle people are selling. But in this case it seems the car was clueless…

Even the reaction is within 0.1s for the machine, you cannot brake and stop immediately. This is physics, and a mechanical problems. Please remove the software mindset when looking into this.

The car can begin to brake right away, and must certainly be expected to have a faster reaction time than a human. Whether it started to brake seems like the most important question here.

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#289
post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're upset for someone using the word "ped" for pedestrian while using a word that's got a dictionary definition of being vulgar and offensive for women? I have to say I'm rather confused. I feel I'm being trolled.

Actually, in UK slang, that refers to someone who's being stupid. And still, everyone knows what it means in the US, I believe. Edit: Sorry about the ambiguity. I wan't referring to "ped". But rather to the slang that's offensive to women.

Upon reflection, I wonder where that British term comes from. Maybe it basically means "woman". Reflecting the slur that women are stupid. So it's still sexist, albeit not as vulgar as the US term.

Re: Police Say Video Shows Woman Stepped Suddenly in Front of Self-Driving Uber

#290
post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't accuse me or other commenters of spreading "rumors and speculations", without evidence or logical arguments. I didn't state a bunch of claims, I linked to a NYT published article. If it turns out that the NYT depicted the incorrect lane, then I expect we'll see a correction. But they published this graphic staked on their reputation for accuracy, not on just "rumors". Moreover, it does not contradict wha…

"It's very hard to imagine a scenario in which a 49-year-old woman walking her bike manages to cross 3 lanes of traffic so quickly that the Uber AV, moving at 40 mph, had no time to react, in a location with good street lighting and with clear weather. I would think most humans would be able to at least hit the brakes, if not completely avoid a collision." Imagining an approximate version of the scenario and thinking…

The parent didn't say that he is imagining anything. Read the post again.

They are saying that based on the information in the NYT article it does not seem credible that the woman came out of nowhere, that there was no time to react, and that the first thing the driver noticed was the sound of hitting the woman before even seeing her. The driver is a party in this story and may well be at fault for causing her death.

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