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Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

theguardian.com

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Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#131

Post by freyir »

swyx wrote: post #96
intended wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean this is HN not Reddit, so I expect most people to know the context of that comment by now (on this site) and his apology and explanation of it. On Reddit the normal person can be forgiven for not knowing the full context of quote, but this quote has come up on HN many times over many years.

can you help me out here? what is the context/explanation?

The context is he was 19 and the quote's from an instant message conversation.

I've never seen an "explanation." It seems self-explanatory. I haven't seen an apology either, but this was in the New Yorker:

When I asked Zuckerberg about the IMs that have already been published online, and that I have also obtained and confirmed, he said that he “absolutely” regretted them ... Zuckerberg’s sophomoric former self, he insists, shouldn’t define who he is now.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2010/09/20/the-face-of-fa...

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#132

Post by to_bpr »

loxs wrote: post #90
freyir wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and surprising for most users of Facebook Yeah, but let's be honest, they're dumb fu * * s.

Why do we censor words? Aren't we all adults here? Does HN have a policy about this?

We're adults here but that doesn't mean we should pursue a higher level of discourse.

If you want cursing or other low content, there's always Reddit.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#134

Post by chopin »

IAmEveryone wrote: post #62
CptMauli wrote: post #14

tell me again why you think the EU General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) is a bad idea?

I was actually surprised by the generally positive reaction the GDPR got in recent threads here on HN. I guess the suspicion of data hoarding overcame conspiracy theories about government regulation or EU protectionism. BUT it’s important to note that GDPR would probably not have had an effect on the specific situation with Cambridge Analytica. CA is obviously toast if not by law then by the attention alone. Facebook…

AFAIK Facebook shared data of non-consenting individuals ("friends") of consenting individuals. In light of the GDPR this would be at least borderline to illegal. As well data from consenting parties was used in a manner not consented to (that would cross the line) and handed over to a fourth party. Finally FB did not ensure proper data handling (crossing the line again). At least when regulators would be willing they'd had a leg to stand on.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#135

Post by zbentley »

flexie wrote: post #48
malikNF wrote: post #3

What's utterly horrifying about this whole thing is how the media is acting as if this is some sort of surprise. Like what did you think was happening at a company collecting data about billions of people? Especially at a company that has a CEO who is famous for calling its own users dumb fu * * s? A company that experimented on at risk teens. Like come on. --edit--- Or lordy, didn't expect this comment to blow up th…

"Parakilas, 38, who now works as a product manager for Uber, ..." So from one reckless company that doesn't give a damn about the law to the next. Who teaches developers that it's okay to work for anyone as long as the tech is cool and the salary is great?

> Who teaches developers that it's okay to work for anyone as long as the tech is cool and the salary is great?

Who teaches them otherwise?

Absent parental/primary-school-instilled ethics, rather a lot of engineers operate in a bubble of like-minded (and similarly-employed) people, making large amounts of money, and are often insulated (voluntarily, deliberately, or accidentally) from the impact of their work.

What could be changed to improve on that situation? I've heard simplistic suggestions to "sue the C-class until they learn/abandon the incredibly lucrative profit motive", "fire/imprison engineers whose changes harm people", and "make the bridge-builder stand under bridge they built" (whatever that means in a software context). Those seem utopian. What tangible, plausible changes can be made to improve on developer accountability (for their work) and discernment (about prospective employers)?

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#136

Post by snarfy »

scottmf wrote: post #4

Oh man this is bad. >the platform operations manager at Facebook responsible for policing data breaches [...] warned senior executives at the company that its lax approach to data protection risked a major breach >One Facebook executive advised him against looking too deeply at how the data was being used, warning him: “Do you really want to see what you’ll find?” >They felt that it was better not to know. I found th…

For the executives, it is better not to know. As soon as they know they are liable and must disclose it. As long as they don't know they can claim ignorance.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#137

Post by jclardy »

simias wrote: post #24
malikNF wrote: post #3

What's utterly horrifying about this whole thing is how the media is acting as if this is some sort of surprise. Like what did you think was happening at a company collecting data about billions of people? Especially at a company that has a CEO who is famous for calling its own users dumb fu * * s? A company that experimented on at risk teens. Like come on. --edit--- Or lordy, didn't expect this comment to blow up th…

It reminds me of the Snowden leaks about mass surveillance programs like PRISM. I think most technical people expected something like that to exist ever since the internet became mainstream. Still, if it's just an "educated rumor" without hard evidence there's not much for the media to talk about. Up until now you could only say "it seems pretty likely that Facebook is doing something like that, but we don't know for…

I think the trust is a new thing though, new to the social media age. I remember growing up with computers in the 90's and people I knew wouldn't even consider entering a credit card number on a website. Now we give them freely. People used anonymous handles on AIM. At some point this changed and people decided they could be themselves on the internet, which is a fine idea, but the trust just went too far.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#138

Post by nathan_long »

freyir wrote: post #76
tmalsburg2 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a matter of fact, this is news and surprising for most users of Facebook even if it's not for you. By saying that no one should be surprised, are you not taking the same condescending attitude that you're pointing out in Zuckerberg?

> and surprising for most users of Facebook Yeah, but let's be honest, they're dumb fu * * s.

No, they're not.

Look, I'm a developer, I'm somewhat privacy-conscious, and I quit Facebook years ago because they're slimy.

But "doesn't keep up with technology and privacy news" is not the same as "dumb". For any product as big as Facebook, there are people of all kinds using it, including many who are brilliant.

Is it wise to trust Facebook with your data? No. But not having come to that conclusion doesn't make someone dumb. Please don't be so condescending. I'm sure many of those "dumb" people could be condescending about some of your life decisions based on their own expertise. But it's not helpful.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#139

Post by Feniks »

1337biz wrote: post #26
scottmf wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me guess. It’s a globalist media conspiracy to take down Trump?

Not at all. Just media's desperate hunger for any story that paints Trump in a bad light. The recent video evidence on Cambridge Analytica shows that they were at least shady in their operations. But their approach to targeting voters and scraping Facebook userdata would have been described as brilliant data wizzardry if it were done for the other side.

Not by me. IDGAF about Trump or American politics. I hate all marketing and advertising equally whether you're selling a politician or cars.

The real story is that there is an entire industry that needs to be reined in, starting with Facebook. Sadly I'm not too optimistic. But whatever: I will just continue to use ublock origin.

Re: Ex-Facebook insider says covert data harvesting was routine

#140

Post by TomK32 »

malikNF wrote: post #3

What's utterly horrifying about this whole thing is how the media is acting as if this is some sort of surprise. Like what did you think was happening at a company collecting data about billions of people? Especially at a company that has a CEO who is famous for calling its own users dumb fu * * s? A company that experimented on at risk teens. Like come on. --edit--- Or lordy, didn't expect this comment to blow up th…

A CEO Mark Zuckerberg who started (or so) the whole thing to get data on his study buddies.
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