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The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

independent.co.uk

41–50 of 163 posts

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#41
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The application is different, but not 'completely different". The use of friend lists harvested from an application to target ads was not known by users. Much of political campaigning, and advertising in general, is exactly as you describe, "using manipulation and psychological techniques to convince". I would agree with you that the purpose of the application was deceptive, but don't most applications that use Faceb…

> Much of political campaigning, and advertising in general, is exactly as you describe, "using manipulation and psychological techniques to convince". Please, just call it what it is: propaganda. Whether you're selling a product, a service or an idea, you're still doing your best to manipulate your target audience. The techniques are the same. And I use the term in a purely clinical sense: manipulation at scale, the…

> Please, just call it what it is: propaganda.

All political campaigns are propaganda, though.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#42
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is completely different. Cambridge Analytica deliberately lied and deceived users about the intention of the application they created to harvest information about users: > Like all app developers, Kogan requested and gained access to information from people after they chose to download his app. His app, “thisisyourdigitallife,” offered a personality prediction, and billed itself on Facebook as “a research app us…

The application is different, but not 'completely different". The use of friend lists harvested from an application to target ads was not known by users. Much of political campaigning, and advertising in general, is exactly as you describe, "using manipulation and psychological techniques to convince". I would agree with you that the purpose of the application was deceptive, but don't most applications that use Faceb…

This is political weaponization of data and information for the purpose of putting an individual in power. It's not me trying to sell you a pug plushie or get you to use my accounting software.

It's deliberately lying to seed fear, distrust, division, and hate between citizens. It's deliberate manipulation to create distrust of government institutions. It's the destruction of civil society and civil discourse for the purpose of winning an election.

This should not be tolerated of anyone, particularly of our own head of state.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#43
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook treats people's volunteered information as goods-for trade. And business is booming!! Politics aside, I wonder how this will affect the "Russian intervention in US and UK politics" search for "truth". I am also expecting that UK authorities will be paying a visit to "Cambridge Analytica" and I hope we will find out the truth on what exactly they did for the UK Referendum, US Elections, and wherever else they…

> let's say that there was no Russian interventios to US election I know you're posing a hypothetical, but your scenario is impossible. Over a dozen Russians have already been indicted. Russia was involved. Period.

Personally, I'm waiting on the indictments of the US citizens, including high-level federal employees/politicians that have done the much same thing for decades in other countries.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#44
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The application is different, but not 'completely different". The use of friend lists harvested from an application to target ads was not known by users. Much of political campaigning, and advertising in general, is exactly as you describe, "using manipulation and psychological techniques to convince". I would agree with you that the purpose of the application was deceptive, but don't most applications that use Faceb…

This is political weaponization of data and information for the purpose of putting an individual in power. It's not me trying to sell you a pug plushie or get you to use my accounting software. It's deliberately lying to seed fear, distrust, division, and hate between citizens. It's deliberate manipulation to create distrust of government institutions. It's the destruction of civil society and civil discourse for the…

The problem here, as is the root of almost all the problems we face in society isn't Cambridge Analytica. The problem is people lack basic critical thinking skills and the capacity to make good decisions.

> It's deliberate manipulation to create distrust of government institutions.

Nobody with any knowledge of history or good sense trusts any government institution.

>It's the destruction of civil society and civil discourse for the purpose of winning an election.

This would require having a civil society filled with civil discourse to start out with, which we didn't (and don't) have.

The simple, irrefutable truth is that governments and those in other centers of power have been using propaganda to control feeble minds and society at large since Woodrow Wilson founded the first official state-run propaganda machine (the CPI) over a hundred years ago.

Everyone is trying to find a "reason" that people rejected "traditional American institutions" and the establishment candidate (Hillary Clinton) in favor of a classless, boorish carnival barker in Donald Trump. They point to the evil Russians, or the dastardly villains at Cambridge Analytics, because they don't want to accept that "traditional American institutions" have been utter garbage for decades. They don't want to accept that many, many Americans are simply rejecting the status quo. Americans may not be smart or informed enough to know exactly what is wrong with "the system", but they know its horribly broken, it doesn't work in their interests, and many of them are reflexively rejecting that system. They aren't rejecting it because of the Russians, or because of some Twitter trolls, or some facebook ads - they are rejecting it because they have seen their standards of living plummet over the last few decades while those at the upper echelon of society have gotten fabulously wealthy. They are rejecting it because so many people are one illness or accident or lost job away from being homeless. They are rejecting it because they have seen (and continue to see) a race to the bottom for working people while the "elites" push for open borders and a massive influx of cheap labor that will make their lives even more difficult.

So keep on crying about the evil Trump and the dastardly Russians, and whatever other phantoms you invent to explain away the growing national discontent while keeping your head in the sand about the real problems we have.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#45
post #36

This is a scandal, and we should not blur lines here. Facebook engages in surveillance capitalism. Cambridge Analytica engages in Orwellian practices of deliberate and targeted mass manipulation, actively deceiving users from the outset about it's intentions, and using lies as a means to an end. From the Facebook report on the reason CA was suspended: > Like all app developers, Kogan requested and gained access to in…

"Facebook engages in surveillance capitalism."

I agree. It seems like the 360-degree camera work they've done in addition to all their work in VR seems more surveillance-related than people are willing to admit but whatever.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#46
This whole thing is just a convenient excuse for people to explain how Trump got into office.

People uploaded their whole shitty lifes onto Facebook while everyone out there warns you to not do that. Yet people argued that they need a place to connect to their friends and all the other crap that FB-users come up with to explain this shitty move (much like cigarette-addicts). Also it is pretty clear how that data is sold. And how intelligence uses it. Snowden? Anyone?

Now that the masses need it they come up with this bullshit story. There have been companies like this before, Democratic and Republican (e.g. Targeted Victory helped Romney, Obama had his Team). The lemmings out there just used the past 4 years to fill Facebook with all the data they could eventually sell to Cambridge Analytica and their friends.

Grow the fuck up people.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#47
post #3

Some regulation I'd like to see for social network ads, at least for political ads: - Make all ads publicly viewable along with the targeting demographics. So everybody can see, for example, that a politician is pushing xenophobia to older people. - Some kind of ad "fake news" score associated with a campaign. This one is difficult, but I could imagine a score based on a mixture of "fake news scoring providers" from…

How about simply banning targeted advertisement? It's clearly toxic to society.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#48
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it so hard to believe that everyone at Facebook is just shocked now to learn the realities of what they do. Their naivety and ignorance would have to be off the charts for it to be genuine.

Maybe it's a lot of young people fresh from college and they hear about the big five or whatever, and choose Facebook because they think of it as a social networking company and big, famous, and cool. Just an old guy's opinion - would not want to work there.

That explains the actions of (some of) Facebook's "rockstar" developers. That does not explain the actions of Facebook's data scientists, psychologists, product managers, and execs.

Occam's razor - They knew, and perhaps they cared, but they cared far more about their salary and climbing the industry ladder to say no or blow the whistle.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#49
post #27

Watch the mini documentary of the undercover op by channel 4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ This isn't just data mining, it's straight up misinformation, entrapment, and god knows what else.

Some additional context via NY Times coverage on the entrapment aspects of Cambridge Analytica's operating procedures. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/us/cambridge-analytica-al... Note: I tried to post this here, because it seemed worthy of its own thread, but it was marked as a dupe for some reason - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16622761

Yeah, same. Not sure if it’s the mods or what.

Re: The Cambridge Analytica scandal isn’t a scandal: this is how Facebook works

#50
post #27

Watch the mini documentary of the undercover op by channel 4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpbeOCKZFfQ This isn't just data mining, it's straight up misinformation, entrapment, and god knows what else.

I read elsewhere that the UK is now planning to raid Cambridge Analytica office/servers in light of this report and that Facebook was also somehow in house with them?
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