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China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

reuters.com

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Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#591

Post by dang »

allthenews wrote: post #586
door3 wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If a correlation is completely explained by controlling for a third factor, that doesn't make the original correlation a lie. The implication of "black people commit more crimes" is that there is something about being black that involves a degree of criminality. It is a very poor way of describing the issue. A much better framing is "black people in the US are disempowered socially, politically and economically and…

>The implication of "black people commit more crimes" is that there is something about being black that involves a degree of criminality It sounds like you are the racist here.

It looks like you've been using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's against the site rules and we ban accounts that do it; we have to, or this place will go up in flames.

Could you please read https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and abide by the rules when commenting here?

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#592

Post by RobertRoberts »

jMyles wrote: post #576
twblalock wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If two groups of people commit the same crimes at similar rates, and individuals in one of those groups are imprisoned more frequently than those in the other group, that's unfair on a systematic level. Nobody here said otherwise. What aspect of this situation makes the GP's advice untrue? For any individual in either group, the best way to avoid becoming a felon is to avoid committing felonies.

> For any individual in either group, the best way to avoid becoming a felon is to avoid committing felonies. I think you're missing the forest for the trees here. For a white, wealthy person, the healthiest life choices are to select a diet based only on the effects of the ingested materials in question, independent of their legal status. For a black person, the healthiest life choice is instead to make very differe…

>For a white, wealthy person [...] For a black person

I don't think it's likely that a purely scientific and non-emotional discussion about race related subjects can be had these days online. Primarily because too many people frame their arguments in such a way to automatically make the other person wrong.

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#593

Post by bawana »

This is WONDERFUL! no really. The first step to a world without money . Imagine a powerful govt AI keeping track of your karma and then determining what you can access, get or use. There won't be any shortcuts or cheats. People with a lot of money will be on the same level as people without. The currency of success will be the help we give to each other. The only way this can work is of course a powerfully networked AI that is transparent. So if somebody seems to be at the top of the heap, everybody else can audit his/her behavior data to see how he/she got there. If this system is not transparent, then it is just another tool for the powerful to exploit the weak.

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#594

Post by wpdev_63 »

simsla wrote: post #377
avcdsuia wrote: post #66

Shenzhen gov are using facial recognition to detect pedestrians running through the red light[0]. Their even release high quality pictures without mosaic in the first version, just a few days ago. [0] https://www.stc.gov.cn/facei/

These are censored (mozaic), as far as I can see. I think the social credit thing sounds horrible, but I don't think there's anything wrong with automatic detection of traffic violations. Traffic codes are here to help people stay safe, they shouldn't be conditional on people seeing a cop.

The problem comes up when send tickets in the mail though. Cops game the system by putting motorway cameras in speeding traps to draw money into the court system.

Atleast when a cop gives you an unjust ticket they have to face you. With a machine it's just print a ticket and ship it out. Who do you appeal to?

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#595

Post by superflb »

eddieplan9 wrote: post #293

I am deeply disgusted by false equivalency used in many posts this thread. Whatever you think the West is doing is not even close to this. The Chinese government owns and runs more than 50% of the economy and 100% of the industries they deem essential. They can not only cut your off completely from planes and trains, but also your electricity, driver license, internet, telephone, banks, ability to get any travel docu…

> I have a Chinese passport, but I cannot even buy train tickets online

you can. Just select passport and fill the passport number. I did it multiple times.

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#596

Post by superflb »

Chaebixi wrote: post #396
xfs wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the law was pretty explicit that Chinese citizens can't fly under their passport This is false. There were rumors in May 2017 that some airports in China started to reject passports for Chinese citizens per some new internal regulations, so that is probably what was initially reported. As is always, the follow-up was never reported again: top aviation administration and public security department later clarified th…

> There were rumors in May 2017 that some airports in China started to reject passports for Chinese citizens per some new internal regulations, so that is probably what was initially reported. That explains it, that's about the time my friend was trying to figure out their document situation for a trip back to China. They ended up opting not to fly domestically because of the uncertainty.

Some people forget or lose their IDs. They can always get temp IDs at train stations or airports.

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#598

Post by sunebeck »

jjcc wrote: post #583
foodislove wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most "Chinese" online seem to be paid trolls who deliberately feed misleading and false information. Either that or they have a switch in the brain where any critisism of China leads to a nationalistic brain freeze where they regurgitate silly propoganda. The Hukou system is broken and inconsistent. Getting mine revoked was the biggest pain the ass. I'm sure there are anecdotal evidence to support your view, but the…

I'm not saying the original poster the "Chinese expat" make up a story. But he gives misleading information. Claim it's fake maybe not accurate. 1.The national ID is revoked only under some special case that the citizen is believed to be leave the country and give up the citizenship.Not for short term stay like visit/travel. For those whose Chinese national ID being revoked, they are not the equivalent of expat in We…

It is not difficult to make a passport reader, and the Chinese are definitely capable of that.

You can read the contents of the RFID chip using $100 off-the-shelf hardware, and the decryption key is the OCR string on the “main” page of the passport.

The piece of glass where you lay the passport, the OCR, and the case itself I’m sure any Chinese contractor could easily do as well.

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#599

Post by anf »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #563
anf wrote: post #445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your career can be destroyed by having the opinions you decided to post in a public forum under your real name copy-pasted, you're an idiot.

The image you're invoking of people getting copy pasta-ed on Facebook is some crazy racist wackjob stuff. Bret Weinstein had his career ruined by simply showing up to work on a day the students decided whites weren't welcome at school.

Right. I was commenting on the former, not the latter.

Per the other example — haven't heard of Bret's story, but if your career is "ruined" by showing up on a day anyone decides whites aren't welcome, seems safe to say you're better off without that career path?

Re: China to bar people with bad 'social credit' from planes, trains

#600

Post by meric »

jryle70 wrote: post #534
IIAOPSW wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're right I hold the US government to a higher standard. When I or many others say "China's doing this but look what the NSA is doing", I am not trying to be a CPC apologist by pointing at the NSA. I am being pro civil liberties by using the CPC as an example of what happens when you don't hold your government to account. America gets to enjoy its relatively high degree of civil liberties precisely because its pop…

I have no problems with criticizing US government agencies for shady or illegal things they did, but there are plenty of posts about those topics already. Doing so in a Chinese related thread comes across as whataboutism, especially because whatever good intention you may have, it is indistinguishable from those that attempt to direct the discussion away from China's issues.

Refusing to engage in whataboutism makes you vulnerable to propaganda from your own country - it allows your government to redirect negative attention towards it's own behaviour to other countries by influencing media organisations to publish certain articles. Of course, some people inevitably says "what about our own government", and this behaviour can be countered by labelling it as "whataboutism".
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