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What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

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Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#11
post #6

After EPA : https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d5/An...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Gold_King_Mine_waste_wate...

The EPA didn't create this mess. They did screw up handling it, however. What happened was that the EPA accidentally released the waste products from an abandoned mine that had been accumulating in a reservoir for decades all at once. What do you think would have happened without any regulation at all? That shit would already be everywhere.

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#13
post #10

This is sort of a contentless post. Certainly the EPA performs a valid role, however that is not to say that any attempts to constrain its increasing creep of scope and overreach of power is automatically bad . Is it possible to find pictures from the late 60s showing pristine beautiful nature shots? Is it possible to find pictures from late 60s showing clean and tidy small town streets? Is it possible to find pictur…

How about the same money as last year (not a 25% cut):

https://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/51780...

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#14
post #6

After EPA : https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d5/An...

I don't think it's fair to equate accidents with the deliberate dumping of pollutants, especially when the accident partially stems from damage caused prior to the EPA.

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#15
post #2

When I was younger, I honestly believed in the explanation that left to their own devices, free enterprise will work to protect the environment, as anything that hurts the market will hurt profits. What I didn't take into account was that this argument doesn't work for enterprises run by beings with limited lifespans. All except the most empathic humans will not incur any cost to avoid consequences that are beyond th…

I consider myself a really pro market guy, but I can't agree with the statement: > free enterprise will work to protect the environment, as anything that hurts the market will hurt profits

I mean, isn't the environment the prime example of a situation where externalities and the tragedy of the commons describe the problems for the free market to solve the problems at hand?

Further, free enterprises exist to maximise their own profit and not to protect the "market".

The only circumstance under which I expect the free market to freely solve any environmental issues is if the consumer demands more (truly) environmentally friendly products and services, moving the demand and hence the profit from polluting products.

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#16
The original quote by Alanis Obomsawin, an Abenaki from the Odanak reserve, was about Canada:

"Canada, the most affluent of countries, operates on a depletion economy which leaves destruction in its wake. Your people are driven by a terrible sense of deficiency. When the last tree is cut, the last fish is caught, and the last river is polluted; when to breathe the air is sickening, you will realize, too late, that wealth is not in bank accounts and that you can’t eat money."

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#18
post #3

Americans love their freedom. Which is more important: the freedom of corporations to innovate in extracting natural resources, or the freedom of citizens to pursue happiness without being poisoned by drinking water? The last photo on that page shows Mary Workman holding a glass of well water that the Hanna Coal Company rendered undrinkable. Something to remember for those who pine for the days of "great coal jobs" a…

Not to take away from the broader point (I think the EPA and like organisations are very important), but would Workman not have recourse through other means (e.g. under nuisance)?

Re: What America looked like before the EPA, in photos

#19
post #10

This is sort of a contentless post. Certainly the EPA performs a valid role, however that is not to say that any attempts to constrain its increasing creep of scope and overreach of power is automatically bad . Is it possible to find pictures from the late 60s showing pristine beautiful nature shots? Is it possible to find pictures from late 60s showing clean and tidy small town streets? Is it possible to find pictur…

Are we on a sustainable path? Should the EPA get more money or less? Right now they are getting a 25% cut. The reduction in regulations will help big corporations, it may even create a few jobs, but it's not in the best interest of the general public, including future generations.
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