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A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

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Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#31

Post by pnloyd »

sarabande wrote: post #6

In the case when you die, but your brain still exists, and it starts processing it again in a new host (computer or organic), isn't that not you anymore? Why would my former self want that? Is this a solved philosophical problem for which literature exists?

There's a game called Soma which has a plot that largely revolves around this question. You play as a man who wakes up mysteriously in an underwater facility as a circumstantial consequence of a "brain scan" you took 100 or so years ago.

The "is it still me?" question pops up over and over throughout the game. It's incredibly thought provoking.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#32

Post by lev99 »

nmeofthestate wrote: post #20
dontreact wrote: post #5

Reconstructing a human in silico from a dead brain is likely to be a very expensive process. Why would anyone in the future be interested in going through with it for any more than a few select old brains when there will be plenty of dead brains to go around at that time?

>likely to be a very expensive process. Obviously it's a huge punt with no guarantee of success, but I would think that in a future that supports such a procedure, the concept of "expensive" won't exist to the same degree as it does now.

Current trends show a future with a higher population and more income inequality. This describes a world where "expensive" is still a thing.

I'm not saying you are incorrect about the future, just pointing out it's against several long term trends.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#33

Post by prepend »

kaizendad wrote: post #28

Seems like a big bet on the concept that the physical structure of the brain preserves enough information to resurrect a consciousness. If electrical transmissions are at all required, then this would render a brain nothing more than an amusing curio. Although, given that their target market is already those planning to be euthanized, I suppose the tradeoff of one's brain being an amusing curio vs. one's brain being…

Clearly, morality and the greater good of humanity requires that we proactively euthanize any genius who hits 60. Even against their will. All assets should go to the euthanasia team to cover costs.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#35

Post by prepend »

kaizendad wrote: post #30
prepend wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You memorize the bitcoin private key before preservation. In a way that requires consciousness to reconstruct. Public key verifies the value and there’s a smart contract with some percentage to the successful recoverer. Depending on the recoverer’s profit margin they will restore whenever there’s enough value to make it worthwhile. Whether bitcoin will exist and whether it will appreciate is a different story. But as…

So then this becomes something like the fast money/slow money system in Charles Stross's Neptune's Brood: people destroy their physical bodies to take slow trips to distant locations, preparing themselves by stockpiling slow money, like bitcoin, that will have significant value in the future but may not have so much now.

I hadn’t read that, but I added it to my list. Sounds interesting.

There have been compound interest sci-fi for a while. I remember the Lazarus Long stories by Heinlein and Orson Scott Card wrote Worthing Saga.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#36

Post by manmal »

prepend wrote: post #33
kaizendad wrote: post #28

Seems like a big bet on the concept that the physical structure of the brain preserves enough information to resurrect a consciousness. If electrical transmissions are at all required, then this would render a brain nothing more than an amusing curio. Although, given that their target market is already those planning to be euthanized, I suppose the tradeoff of one's brain being an amusing curio vs. one's brain being…

Clearly, morality and the greater good of humanity requires that we proactively euthanize any genius who hits 60. Even against their will. All assets should go to the euthanasia team to cover costs.

Do you refer to a certain Star Trek episode? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_a_Life_(Star_Trek:_The_...

(Ritual suicide at age 60 embedded in culture)

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#37

Post by prepend »

carbocation wrote: post #14
prepend wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You memorize the bitcoin private key before preservation. In a way that requires consciousness to reconstruct. Public key verifies the value and there’s a smart contract with some percentage to the successful recoverer. Depending on the recoverer’s profit margin they will restore whenever there’s enough value to make it worthwhile. Whether bitcoin will exist and whether it will appreciate is a different story. But as…

Then they threaten to resurrect you 1000x and torture each of your resurrected selves for 1000 years unless you tell them the private key. Roko's basilisk meets bitcoin.

That will likely be more expensive than just resurrecting you.

I’d structure with smart contracts with a certain price for digital. Another price for full physical. Keep other assets outside of consciousness in legal trusts.

There may be torturers, but likely non-torturers as well. Knowing this, tortured versions of me won’t crack as they don’t care.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#38

Post by piracykills »

Jesus_Jones wrote: post #25
carbocation wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then they threaten to resurrect you 1000x and torture each of your resurrected selves for 1000 years unless you tell them the private key. Roko's basilisk meets bitcoin.

Meets Altered Carbon. But if you wake up in virtual reality, when you enter your key, how can you keep them from taking it from you? You'll never know if you are being man-in-the-middled.

We constructed a whole reality to steal your keys - the world's most advanced phishing attack.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#39

Post by prepend »

Jesus_Jones wrote: post #25
carbocation wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then they threaten to resurrect you 1000x and torture each of your resurrected selves for 1000 years unless you tell them the private key. Roko's basilisk meets bitcoin.

Meets Altered Carbon. But if you wake up in virtual reality, when you enter your key, how can you keep them from taking it from you? You'll never know if you are being man-in-the-middled.

This is a bigger problem. But the smart contract should be verifiable if the blockchain still exists. If it doesn’t then your currency is probably worthless so resurrectors won’t bother.

Although I’m not sure how you would verify your messages with private key without revealing to whatever is managing your consciousness’ memory.

Re: A startup is pitching a mind-uploading service that is “100 percent fatal”

#40

Post by sushid »

sarabande wrote: post #6

In the case when you die, but your brain still exists, and it starts processing it again in a new host (computer or organic), isn't that not you anymore? Why would my former self want that? Is this a solved philosophical problem for which literature exists?

What if you think of it like "I wish I could give my kids advice even when I'm long gone" or "would I wish to care for the well being of a son/daughter I never knew I had?" If so, what if that kid was 100% your genes instead of 50%?
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