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MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

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Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#81
post #22

MoviePass announced their their new, improved, and unrestricted plans in August. We all knew the $10 a month plan was not going to be profitably by itself. In the last week they have started blocking out specific movies, requiring some users to provide photographic proof of their ticket purchases, and bragged about collecting data outside what is described in their TOS. This is after already locking out customers fro…

> We all knew the $10 a month plan was not going to be profitably by itself. How is this kind of "growth hack" not simply dumping[1]? The only new development here is that dumping is no longer limited to large companies with large war chests thanks to the availability of venture capital. The more interesting question is can healthy, truly profitable technology companies develop in an environment where they have to co…

I don't think the environment will stay like this for long.

Investors in MoviePass will likely not make their money back. Or maybe they'll break even on a sale of assets to some major theater chain, if everyone involved is smart.

Afterward, future investors in companies like this will use MoviePass as another example for the fact the times when you could form a business mostly based on collecting user data is over. The stakes have changed, the goalposts have moved; Google/Facebook sized ingestion of user data is still very profitable, but now startups have to compete with that. So MoviePass knows which movies I go see and where I go before and after... Google knows where I am literally all the time.

They really should have started from day 1 trying to play ball with the theater chains. Theaters always made most of their money on concessions; incentivize upsells into that and get subsidies on ticket prices from the chains. Instead, they burned every bridge with the theaters they could have hoped to make. They'll pay for it.

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#82

From my understanding, the bet that MoviePass is making is that they will be able to sell user/usage data to studios (or others) to make back the money that they're losing paying full price on the tickets; they've even admitted this in other interviews... just without specifying what data. Even if it's not location data, I would imagine that any/all data they can associate with a user they will.

I doubt it. That data isn’t worth more than the movie admission.

The real goal is probably more like ticket scalpers... see how pricing motivates behavior and now demand can be shaped. The value generator would be either tiering the service offering or charging a premium for certain movies.

If they can demonstrate that flat rate pricing generates demand for movie viewing, even for shitty movies, they could buy excess inventory and give away shit movies or slack times and charge a premium for good movies or peak times.

It is almost certainly achievable. Back in my high school/college days I had access to unlimited free movies through various means. I saw every movie in the theaters from 1996-1999. We could get into hot movies the first week, so we watched whatever was available.

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which isn't profitable. If you want MoviePass to exist, they need another source of revenue...

That's the struggle. Virtually unlimited movie tickets each month for the price of one movie ticket a month sounds too good to be true because it is. There's no way for this to work without some other source of revenue. If you would like the option to pay more and NOT be tracked, we just call that buying movie tickets and you've been able to do it all along.

[deleted]

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#84

I don't see the big deal really, Google maps and the like has probably 100x the data plus the mean to make it evil. I don't really see what extra data they will have compare to just ticket sales. It seems just a bad VC bet, and you can take advantage of it.

Some people here are hilarious. Bad if moviepass goes it - Fine if google/Facebook/Apple/etc does it.

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a link on that or are you talking about the current article? I believe you but I wasn't one of the early adopters of MoviePass so by the time I joined I skimmed the contract, nodded, and thought "Got it, you spy on me and I get cheap stuff."

some vaugely worded crap that would take a lawyer to figure out buried in a 40 page TOS isn't informed consent, sorry.

I'm not sure why your tone is so hostile when I was just asking a clarifying question. More to your point, I don't see what part of the ToS you found especially convoluted, but since your estimate about the length is so exaggerated I doubt you actually read it. The wording was boring but clear and its formatting wasn't particularly mysterious either.

If your point is more generally that we shouldn't be able to just skim a ToS and give consent, what's your alternative that doesn't destroy the ability of online businesses to engage in these kinds of agreements?

Edit: I'm adding this here because I can't reply to the comment below me by s73v3r_ 26.

You in particular might not care, but there are a lot of people who feel like these businesses provide valuable services and don't mind being expected to actually be accountable for the things they agree to. If you don't like ToS businesses online, come up with an alternative. Otherwise, unless your plan is just to go on a tirade, you need to at least try to consider an alternative to outright destruction or your argument is going to lose all of its persuasive power when talking to people who do value these services.

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#86
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iOS 11 introduced the ability to allow apps to only access your location while you're actively using the app. Using this method should be a good mitigation.

Unfortunately apps don’t care. Waze lingers up to 40 minute after traveling in the background and that’s with supposed in app only mode.

Unless I'm mistaken they don't have access to your location while running in the background. Running != access to location.

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#87
As far as I'm concerned, it would hardly matter if the theaters charged $0 for movies.

My family almost always goes to the movies for a "family date night". Last night our concession stand bill was over $60, and that's just because I din't have a drink and we didn't get popcorn.

The theater we pretty much exclusively go to is one of those fancy places with the power recliners and food, so we will usually eat dinner there.

I know, this is choices we make when seeing a movie. But, I can't AFFORD to get unlimited movies for $10/month. :-)

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

some vaugely worded crap that would take a lawyer to figure out buried in a 40 page TOS isn't informed consent, sorry.

I'm not sure why your tone is so hostile when I was just asking a clarifying question. More to your point, I don't see what part of the ToS you found especially convoluted, but since your estimate about the length is so exaggerated I doubt you actually read it. The wording was boring but clear and its formatting wasn't particularly mysterious either. If your point is more generally that we shouldn't be able to just s…

"what's your alternative that doesn't destroy the ability of online businesses to engage in these kinds of agreements?"

Why should we care about preserving one of the worst business practices of recent times?

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#89

A monthly subscription cost for "unlimited" movies priced lower than the price of a single movie? Mind you, my mum wouldn't understand that at that point she's the product. However, the ol' "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is" is something everyone should know. I don't agree with MoviePass' approach - which is the reason I haven't subscribed - but unless it's blatantly illegal I think it's safe to presu…

Unfortunately it's the world we live in now. Unless iOS is so compromised (wouldn't be surprised) that MoviePass can read data from other apps, an app that runs temporarily for me to check into a movie and I can turn location services on/off and see unlimited movies for $8/month is pretty great! Sure, a little more work (few seconds?) to turn location services on/off a few times a month but in general I think it's worth it.

The more value I can get circumventing businesses where the model is to collect and sell data, the better. I love the niche model of pay a little bit of money, get more value back and have the option to be tracked by a device that I control better than a lot of the shady "free" companies (facebook, pinterest, instagram, nextdoor, google, etc)

Re: MoviePass CEO says the app tracks your location before and after movies

#90

As far as I'm concerned, it would hardly matter if the theaters charged $0 for movies. My family almost always goes to the movies for a "family date night". Last night our concession stand bill was over $60, and that's just because I din't have a drink and we didn't get popcorn. The theater we pretty much exclusively go to is one of those fancy places with the power recliners and food, so we will usually eat dinner t…

Huh. All the folks I know bring their libation (beer even sometimes) and even food into the theater.

My wife and I always eat first, then take a small snack in her bag and that's it.

Of course, we don't go to an upscale theater.

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