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Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

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Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#131

Post by regulation_d »

ancap wrote: post #122
pfortuny wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MMmmmh, but you do not lose your job as a dry wall contractor. You lose your “uber driver” job if you do not accept uber’s fares. What am I missing?

"Dry wall contractor" is a pretty generic job title. "Uber driver" is very specific including the "location" where the driver is working. To make the analogy fair you'd have to do have a "Dry wall contractor for Boeing" or similar.

Unless there are non-competes in place, the analogy is fine. You have the freedom to use the platform or to not use it, and often you have the freedom to use other platforms simultaneously.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#132

Post by jakewins »

bparsons wrote: post #121

The flaw in these studies are the assumption that the person would not have a car unless they were an Uber/Lyft driver. This has a huge impact on the final per hour calculations. If the vehicle is a fixed cost for the person regardless of whether or not they are a driver, then factoring in the cost and depreciation of the vehicle isn't really a fair measure.

> If the vehicle is a fixed cost for the person regardless of whether or not they are a driver

What? Vehicles are clearly not fixed cost, they are assets that deprecate in value from use. There is some deprecation from age, but by far the determinant of value is miles driven and damage from use.

Every mile you drive for Uber is costing you money in lower resale value of your vehicle, both from the miles you add to it and from the probability of damaging the vehicle in an accident.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#133

Post by taneq »

regulation_d wrote: post #111
misterbishop wrote: post #41

Discussing a rideshare worker's take-home pay as "profit" really accepts the framing of the company. Yes it's technically true that each driver is an independent contractor ("Small Business Owner"), but this designation is a farce without the ability to set pricing. The take-home pay isn't profit in practice, it's wages less unreimbursed expenses.

Let’s say I’m a dry wall contractor. A general contractor comes along and offers me $20k for a job. I say “$25k?” and he says, “No, $20k.” If I take the job I am not magically transformed into an employee of his, simply because I lacked the bargaining power to negotiate the rate. The reason I am still a contractor is that I have absolute control over whether to agree to do that job at that price. There are obviously…

I don't know about the U.S. but in Australia there are strict rules about 'sham contracting'. To be treated as an independent contractor you can't get more than 80% of your income from any one source. If you 'contract' to just one employer you're an employee for both tax purposes and protections.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#134

Post by dionidium »

slededit wrote: post #124
csomar wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber was more expensive than a Taxi for me in Paris. Uber gave me a 10-14 euros quote. And for the same distance the taxi took only 7 euros. I'm pretty sure the math might be working on some places. I'm only suggesting that it is possibly not working on other places and users are not aware of that.

There's been a few times where the yellow cab flat rate to JFK was cheaper than Uber in NYC as well.

Yes, this happens. For example, it's raining in Manhattan right now and Uber to JFK is more than the flat-rate from where I'm sitting.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#135

Post by lykahb »

taneq wrote: post #133
regulation_d wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let’s say I’m a dry wall contractor. A general contractor comes along and offers me $20k for a job. I say “$25k?” and he says, “No, $20k.” If I take the job I am not magically transformed into an employee of his, simply because I lacked the bargaining power to negotiate the rate. The reason I am still a contractor is that I have absolute control over whether to agree to do that job at that price. There are obviously…

I don't know about the U.S. but in Australia there are strict rules about 'sham contracting'. To be treated as an independent contractor you can't get more than 80% of your income from any one source. If you 'contract' to just one employer you're an employee for both tax purposes and protections.

If you drive both for Lyft and Uber your income structure may satisfy that criterion.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#136

Post by tibbon »

In speaking with various drivers I've had I either hear that driving for [Lyft|Uber] is great, or terrible. There's rarely any in between.

I've had drivers who had worked with them for years, and seemed to be really happy, also new ones who were happy. Perhaps they have lower living expenses, or this is more pay than they made at other ventures, or uniquely fits their lives.

And I've had others who are really frustrated with the app, the GPS, traffic, the company, their compensation, the Pooling services, riders, etc.

Of note these are generally in the same geographic areas roughly (Boston and SF is where I ride most and flip between services as needed), so in theory it's sampling from a similar population.

One thing in particular I've asked drivers is if pool-services work ok for them. About half say yes and seem to love it, and the other half grumble that it never makes them any money.

I really wish I knew the other factors that go into this to understand the root causes better.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#138

Post by wgerard »

ashelmire wrote: post #74
pwinnski wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That people think vehicle wear costs are negligible is how Uber manages to convince people to drive for such low wages. People are bad at math.

If someone is making $20/hr net income driving at night (pretty average for big cities according to this: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1s08BdVqCgrZWZkV0ZfZnhGUGc... ), do you really think the wear costs are more than a few bucks per hour?

Usage costs for cars are usually tagged at around $0.50-$0.60 per mile [1]. Looking around, seems like the average 8 hour uber driver is putting on about 100-200 miles per shift [2].

So assuming 150 miles per 8 hours, the average uber driver is paying about $11/hr in fuel and depreciation costs.

So the net income after that would probably be more like $9/hr.

1: http://newsroom.aaa.com/tag/driving-cost-per-mile/

2: https://www.quora.com/How-many-miles-does-a-full-time-driver...

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#139

Post by codegladiator »

regulation_d wrote: post #118
pfortuny wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MMmmmh, but you do not lose your job as a dry wall contractor. You lose your “uber driver” job if you do not accept uber’s fares. What am I missing?

As someone who hasn’t driven for Uber, I’m not sure what that looks like. What are the conditions under which you would lose you “uber driver” job?

Under the condition where the driver demands a higher amount of money. Or even their fair share.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#140

Post by mywittyname »

joncrocks wrote: post #30
FLUX-YOU wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but today every insurance company asks specifically if this vehicle was ever used in a driving service and will deny claims if it was found to be. This seems crazy or wrong. If I buy a vehicle used as an Uber/Lyft vehicle and that's on record somewhere, but I've never been an Uber/Lyft driver, I will get my claims denied?

I think it's maybe worded a bit confusingly. It's more likely that if you are trying to claim on your insurance, they will ask you "have you driven for a ride-share service at any point since the start of your policy" and deny your claim if you have. And presumably it's fraud if you lie on the claim.

Yes, this. I was involved in an accident a few months back and adjuster for both companies asked if I ever used this car to drive for a ride sharing service. I don't recall it being limited to the duration of the policy though.
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