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Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

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Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#81

Post by aianus »

mywittyname wrote: post #12
filesystem wrote: post #8

“Of the five sources of cost estimated per mile (Insurance, Maintenance, Repairs, Fuel and Depreciation), approximately 40% of costs are attributable to Insurance, Maintenance and Repairs, 40% to fuel expenses, and 20% to depreciation.” I don’t understand how insurance is a relevant cost. Insurance is required to legally operate a vehicle - this is something that they must have for their personal vehicle regardless o…

Insurance for driving an Uber/Lyft is much more expensive than regular insurance, because it's considered commercial. In previous years, people could get away with not having it, but today every insurance company asks specifically if this vehicle was ever used in a driving service and will deny claims if it was found to be.

Absolutely false, I pay nothing extra to drive for Uber and my personal insurance knows exactly what I'm doing:

https://www.intact.ca/on/en/personal-insurance/vehicle/car/u...

The relevant quote that applies to me: "When Uber drivers are using their vehicle for personal use, Intact Insurance, Novex, Jevco and belairdirect customers are protected as usual under their personal auto insurance policy at no additional cost."

And yes, the policies are the same price or cheaper than the competitors that don't have ridesharing included. They make up the money by attracting customers like me and by getting paid premiums by Uber for the commerical portion of the coverage.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#82

Post by bsenftner »

martin_bech wrote: post #38

3 problems. 1. This is at subsidised Uber pricing, where Uber is loosing money at an alarming rate. 2. This means driving for Uber is terrible economicly. 3. This also implies that even getting to driverless cars, Uber will only save 3.37 per hour, not making the business model viable, I would think.

I've felt Uber was a scan from day one. About a year after they expanded out of San Francisco, I had the opportunity to socially meet Travis Kalanick. That ended any speculation I had that Uber was NOT a fraud. All he ever wanted to do was run up a valuation and cash out, any way possible. Then it grew like wild, and he became an Uber Corrupt Asshole. That is the person I met socially.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#84

Post by dsfyu404ed »

bitcurious wrote: post #42
martin_bech wrote: post #38

3 problems. 1. This is at subsidised Uber pricing, where Uber is loosing money at an alarming rate. 2. This means driving for Uber is terrible economicly. 3. This also implies that even getting to driverless cars, Uber will only save 3.37 per hour, not making the business model viable, I would think.

3. This also implies that even getting to driverless cars, Uber will only save 3.37 per hour, not making the business model viable, I would think. Should be higher. Insurance, energy and maintenance will be cheaper at the scale of Uber's fleet. Driving style might be optimized for MPG. Cars will be available 24/7 with no downtime.

They'll save more than that.

They'll be registering/insuring the vehicles in a state where it's cheap to do so.

Uber's geographic distribution results in the average uber driving paying significantly more baseline cost just to legally field the vehicle. Being able to choose your jurisdiction is probably a ~$1k per year savings over the current Uber driver average.

TBH one of the things I'm looking forward to about self driving cars is that states will be forced to actually compete with each other on registration/insurance/tax.

>Driving style might be optimized for MPG

If (NumSecondsLightHasBeenRed()) > 3 && NobodyInFrontOfMe){keepgoing()}

Not quite what you had in mind, was it? Remember, this is Uber, we're talking about.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#85

Post by davrosthedalek »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #44
martin_bech wrote: post #38

3 problems. 1. This is at subsidised Uber pricing, where Uber is loosing money at an alarming rate. 2. This means driving for Uber is terrible economicly. 3. This also implies that even getting to driverless cars, Uber will only save 3.37 per hour, not making the business model viable, I would think.

The third point is definitely wrong. Once you have a fleet of driverless cars, you can optimize their routes to perfection, have almost zero down time, so you would need fewer cars in general. And less liability.

While you are right in principle, I'm not sure if the downtime argument holds: Breaks of the driver are not paid currently. The car lifetime is probably not set by age, but total miles driven.

Self-driving cars might be more expensive, too, in maintenance (more things that can break) and initial cost. So I'm not sure how much they can gain.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#86

Post by tom_mellior »

eqdw wrote: post #71

Ways in which this headline is potentially misleading: 1) Driving for Uber/Lyft/etc is not a full time job, and was not intended to be a full time job. It's a piecemeal work side job. The flexibility of working when you want, and not working when you don't want, is valuable and you don't get it for free. 2) "Profit" is not income. This is profit net of expenses. Expenses that, among other things, you can write off ag…

> Driving for Uber/Lyft/etc is not a full time job [...] They consistently report to me that they make between $40k and $55k/yr.

Is this 55k from part-time Ubering, or is this 55k in total, most of which comes from their "real" full-time job and a small fraction from Ubering, or is it 55k from full-time Ubering in direct contradiction of what you said, or what?

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#87

Post by mseebach »

csomar wrote: post #66

Two things: 1. The cost is absorbed by another entity, usually the parents. It is the parents' car, or your parents bought you a car. You need some quick cash, so you basically "eat out" of that car to generate that "cash". 2. You are trapped in a situation where you need quick cash. So you "eat out" of your vehicle to generate that cash. This also happens when you have a low "realization" consciousness. (ie: You are…

Uber has deals with car rental agencies in several places that doesn't "allow" you to "eat out" your vehicle equity (I've seen Enterprise in CA and, I think, one other place, and Otto in London). The viability of such deals suggests that the numbers work out even without spending your equity.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#88

Post by balls187 »

eqdw wrote: post #71

Ways in which this headline is potentially misleading: 1) Driving for Uber/Lyft/etc is not a full time job, and was not intended to be a full time job. It's a piecemeal work side job. The flexibility of working when you want, and not working when you don't want, is valuable and you don't get it for free. 2) "Profit" is not income. This is profit net of expenses. Expenses that, among other things, you can write off ag…

> I often ask Uber drivers in SF how they like their jobs, what they make, etc.

When I query drivers, I often get the same sentiment that they are with Uber by choice. Unhappy uber drivers leave, either because the platform penalizes them by way of bad ratings, the economics don't work, or some other reason.

While the numbers from the study seem abysmal when distilled down to the per-hour profit, it hasn't dissuaded drivers from stick with the platform as a viable mean of income.

It sounds like the 1100 drivers surveyed displayed different characteristics. I'd be more interested in more granular data, such as the per-hour rate based on the number of miles driven, length of tenure, location, star rating.

Re: Uber, Lyft Drivers Earning a Median Profit of $3.37 per Hour, Study Says

#89

Post by bsenftner »

zemvpferreira wrote: post #7

I wonder how much airbnb hosts are making. In Lisbon most airbnb hosts are amateurs who spend a few hours every week cleaning and greeting, and get the bejeezus taxed out of their parallel activity. I wonder if they’re doing any better than “transportation entrepreneurs” working for ridesharing companies.

In Los Angeles, my sister was AirBnB'ing a very nice 2 bdrm condo in an architecturally famous French Castle moved from France to the Hollywood Hills. The condo itself is the former home of a young Frank Sinatra, and the Castle currently has Slash from G&R using a unit as a local get-away. You'd think a place such as this could get a decent rate, right? It goes for under $100 a night right now. The market is so saturated, there is no market.
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