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Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

theguardian.com

111–120 of 273 posts

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#111
The median driver, huh?

I'd guess 90% of the Uber/Lyft miles driven are done by 5% of the drivers.

The median driver is probably someone halfassing it like I did. Trying it occasionally for an hour or two, without much of a plan. Seeing what it's like.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#112
post #69
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it interesting how the same people that have no problem accepting that the last 10% of a random software project accounts for a significant portion of the total time spent, can at the same time be so unreasonably optimistic that a whole sphere of tech can go from like 70% to 100% (where 100% is also the minimum amount required) in a really short period.

Probably for the same reason software developers can't estimate tasks. At least for me the problem is that I figure out the algorithm at a high level and base my estimate around how long that will take me. But inevitably there are platform gotchas, or the API doesn't work the way I expect, or I forgot/didn't know about edge case. (I've done this enough that I have an idea of what kind of things can go wrong now) I th…

You would have to defend that humans make good decisions in such cases. I would argue that, for the majority, they do not.

I have been in all of those situations except for the black car, and the humans involved all made spectacularly poor decisions.

People who claim that self-driving cars will have failure modes far underestimate the failure modes that humans have.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#113
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not as certain about that. Potentially optimistic, but I could imagine bikes taking on a larger role as we move to self driving cars. If you read threads about biking[0], people seem to be motivated to bike more than they are motivated to drive. Although these same people are stymied by negative conditions. Self driving cars could improve biking conditions by opening up roadways, making them safer, providing bett…

I think I agree with the biking in general, self driving cars will probably make biking a lot safer both by reducing the chances of an idiot running into you, and reducing the number of parked cars on roads (riding beside parked cars is scary, because you are never sure when a door is going to open into you). I don't think that I necessarily agree that this means bike shares will succeed though, I think private bike…

I have a bike and there are bike shares around me. I am still trying to figure out a policy, but I lean towards bike share for everything short, because it’s like a taxi, you don’t need to go back to your bike. But bike share are crappy, so for longer distance I need bigger wheels and gears.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#114
post #97
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 million is a laughable low coverage. Get into a single accident where someone has to get emergency surgery, a few months in the hospital, and then needs physical therapy to walk again. One million is gone faster than you can imagine.

1 million is far far higher than what most people carry. It's plenty.

Interesting. In Germany the lowest legally possible coverage is 7.5 million € for damages to a person plus 1.22 million for other damages, but 50 to 100 million is the general coverage. Just to give some perspective on how expensive accidents can be.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#115
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

However, the insurance provided by Uber and Lyft only cover when you have a passenger in the car -- they don't cover you when you are driving to pick up the next person. And your own insurance also doesn't cover you during that period, unless you buy a separate commercial rider.

that's not true. it covers the driver while the app is on. https://www.uber.com/drive/insurance/ > While you’re online with Uber before you accept a request, you are covered by our insurance policy for your liability to a third party if you are in an accident when you’re at fault

Only when you're at fault?

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#116
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a bit curious about the dockless bike shares too, I suspect the same thing.

I'm not as certain about that. Potentially optimistic, but I could imagine bikes taking on a larger role as we move to self driving cars. If you read threads about biking[0], people seem to be motivated to bike more than they are motivated to drive. Although these same people are stymied by negative conditions. Self driving cars could improve biking conditions by opening up roadways, making them safer, providing bett…

I was skeptical about the business model, the bikes cost a lot, are rented for cheap, and for some reasons the companies go head to head in the same towns instead of covering different areas.

And if they kill each other and the winner raises the price, I suspect Detroit wins.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#117

The median driver, huh? I'd guess 90% of the Uber/Lyft miles driven are done by 5% of the drivers. The median driver is probably someone halfassing it like I did. Trying it occasionally for an hour or two, without much of a plan. Seeing what it's like.

Part-time drivers are also likely to already own their own car so factoring in 100% of vehicle depreciation is disingenuous. It only makes sense to father most if not all of vehicle depreciation for those drivers that are working full time.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#118

I guess what makes driving different than other low-wage jobs is that it’s a relatively easy job to obtain if you already have the vehicle: you don’t have to do a bunch of interviews, you don’t need a huge amount of ability, you can start making money pretty much immediately. Having a reliable income can be important (as opposed to jobs that limit your hours, etc.). Of course, it’s obviously a terrible wage. Anecdota…

In addition, driving in the comfort of your own car with your own music is genuinely more enjoyable than working in a greasy fast food kitchen.

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#119

Uber is losing billions and their drivers are making peanuts. That sounds sustainable.

It was never designed to be sustainable. Why does nobody get that yet? The only reason Uber and Lyft work is that there are a ton of people with limited job skills, who have time on their hands, are short on cash, and need to spend their extra time trying to make money. Sure, there may be "bored people" who do this because they're retired or whatever, but that's a tiny minority. Most people do not become part-time ca…

All good points.

I used to drive a taxi - I fell into it when I needed a job but was overqualified for just about everything. I learned a lot from my passengers.

The taxi company I used to drive for has adapted. I think they'll survive until uber runs out of money, simply because fleets of similar vehicles are cheaper to maintain. A Prius will last 400,000 miles, with rebuilt batteries and cheap parts from a boneyard (retired/wrecked vehicles).

The taxi company now leases unbranded cars that can be used by drivers for any of the app-based services. The company's contracts pay better than non-surge uber fares, which motivates the drivers to take care of the company's contracts too.

> Point is, the gig economy is here because almost every strata of people below "upper-middle-class" have been getting slowly screwed for decades.

I call the phenomenon "economic cancer".

Re: Uber and Lyft drivers' median hourly wage is just $3.37, report finds

#120

This doesn't surprise me at all and it's because of hidden costs incurred by the driver, combined with an implicit bidding system that drives down wages. Hidden costs: 1. Vehicle wear and tear (cars cost you money when you drive them) 2. Vehicle depreciation (cars cost you money even when you aren't driving them) 3. Interest and fees associated with auto loans and leases 4. Insurance premiums 5. Gas 6. Unexpected/unp…

Subsidized public transportation is nearly essentially for a world-class city, but it anchors the value of a ride in people's minds, which is brutal for the private transportation market. My own labor is valued at a lot more than $12 per hour, but I don't even blink at getting in the car for 20 minutes for $4 - if anything, Lyft and Uber start to look expensive in comparison to the local metro.
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