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Cities and Ambition (2008)

paulgraham.com

41–50 of 59 posts

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#41
post #12

I mostly agree, though the whole Cambridge bit was a bit overdone IMHO. NYC seems to be slowly changing though, finance and money seem to be losing prestige a bit in favor of tech. Ten years ago there was "a" NY Tech Meetup. Now there are many dozens if not hundreds, it certainly feels you could attend one every day. I feel I walk around and see a lot more people these days whom I say to myself "they are definitely i…

NYC always had a strong tech environment.

> finance and money seem to be losing prestige a bit in favor of tech.

Money will never lose its prestige in NYC. Tech is now where the money is going so I guess the prestige will naturally increase.

> I feel I walk around and see a lot more people these days whom I say to myself "they are definitely in tech" whereas 10 years ago or so that would rarely happen.

What? I worked all throughout the 2000s in tech in NYC. We've always been here.

The second largest tech industry in the world is in NYC after silicon valley. And it's been that way for a long time.

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also applies to the oft-cited Good Will Hunting line about getting a great education for the price of some overdue books at the library. Yep, definitely, sure, you're right: you could definitely learn everything you would in college on your own. But you won't.

There are autodidacts who can go a long way with a big library (or nowadays: sci-hub, b-ok, MOOCs) and their own self-directed study. But if you haven't started on that path before finishing high school, it seems extremely risky to assume that you can start doing it instead of attending a university. Further, if you're already self-motivated and learning on your own, you're probably going to have a lot of (intellectu…

You must have gone to a University with better students than the one I went to, because the majority of the people I went to University with just wanted a piece of paper, and so "will this be on the test" was essential to their well-being and learning was at best secondary.

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#43
You can call it 'ambition' all you want. It's really experience and wisdom that leads to less fool-hardy 'ambition'. That's why I left NYC for smaller cities and rural areas. The wisdom of having dealt with the money changers looking to capitalize on gleamy eye'd fools having just landed in said city. Play your stocks and equity games with the next generation and keep chiming on about your perverse culture's 'ambition' requirements. I know a modern-day usurer playing PR games when I see one.

This is all so clearly just thinly veiled, hopefully manipulative, status-signaling.

For the incoming replies that inevitably address their imaginary audience instead of engaging me in good faith: here's my offer to you, a sharpened stick for you to sit on.

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#44
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are autodidacts who can go a long way with a big library (or nowadays: sci-hub, b-ok, MOOCs) and their own self-directed study. But if you haven't started on that path before finishing high school, it seems extremely risky to assume that you can start doing it instead of attending a university. Further, if you're already self-motivated and learning on your own, you're probably going to have a lot of (intellectu…

You must have gone to a University with better students than the one I went to, because the majority of the people I went to University with just wanted a piece of paper, and so "will this be on the test" was essential to their well-being and learning was at best secondary.

I was a freshman in 1998 and received my BS 4 years later. Was your experience more recent? I wonder if my experience was better due to the respective schools we attended, the timeframe, or perhaps both. I get the impression that credentialism is still worsening over time.

Intensified credentialism has the effect of diluting classrooms that could be engaging with a bunch of people who are just XP-grinding to level up to a job in 4 years. I do feel bad for people who are there due to distorted economic incentives rather than genuine interest. I also resent them for polluting the intellectual environment of students who are actually interested in the material.

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#46
Going through a period of personal reflection right now. Have read the OP essay easily a dozen times over the last 5-6 years. Somehow I read it again yesterday and by chance, here it is today, HN front page.

I'm a traditionally educated engineer (comp eng degree from big 10 midwestern school) who was what I'd call medium ambitious. I knew I didn't want to end up somewhere in some small backwater in suburban Chicago (where I'm from) doing IT for a bank. I always wanted to make great products and sell them for money.

Silicon Valley has changed a lot in the 7 years I've lived here. It's crazy how much venture capital is getting raised today. It seems like almost every week, there's yet another record broken in VC. Instacart just raised 400 million dollars recently. And now Justin Kan's Atrium is doing $10 million on a story and it seems practically every day another self-driving car startup is doing a nine-figure raise.

Looking back, pg is right. For as much as SV claims to be about technology/innovation, it's really all driven by the fastest route to economic power. The place has become noticeably more driven by business guys, "growth hacking", virality, etc. than actual product innovation. Maybe it's for the best, as a lot of innovation is actually in distribution (not just product). But it does make me wonder, what's next for this place?

The big question I'm trying to figure out for myself is, do I want to play the big-money startup game or be a small business owner? The distinction is getting sharper each day. I never really wanted to be a billionaire but realistically, "having a big effect on the world" is absolutely how things are measured here, and if you aren't trying to dent the universe, you're basically viewed as a zero here.

It's interesting what guys like tom preson-werner have done. He could probably be a famous brand-name VC (has the resume and connections for it) but instead, he's doing a second company in language learning. I really respect that he wants to build good stuff, even if it doesn't mean raising a bazillion dollars. I'm not surprised the company isn't HQ'd here.

EDIT: It's also interesting how just "doing something big" impresses SV, even if you don't succeed. Examples: Slava (rethinkdb), Dalton Caldwell (several failed startups, now partner at YC), Adora Cheung (also partner at YC after Homejoy crashed and burned), etc. They seem to respect ambition perhaps even more than building a solid business or company. It's really bizarre.

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#47

PG never fails to stimulate ideas. I'm in New Orleans. Our cities form of status is totally who you know. Money is not as big of adeal. A billionaire has less clout than the owner of a operation that designs Mardi Gras floats or the bartender that is the lead of the Krewe of Elvi. I think that is what you would call "Soul" possibly. After travelling to a bunch of other cities and seeing unfettered capitalism destroy…

It's exactly the "laissez les bon temps rouler" mentality in NOLA that keeps it from becoming a booming tech incubator (for the reasons in the article), but that's not necessarily a bad thing. There's nowhere else like the Crescent city, and I hope it stays that way. Although you're more likely to overhear discussions about last night's debauchery than the next billion-dollar startup, you'll never be able to relax in…

I live in NOLA. Universities cannot retain promising young faculty because they don’t want to raise kids here (unless they were born here themselves)

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#48

PG never fails to stimulate ideas. I'm in New Orleans. Our cities form of status is totally who you know. Money is not as big of adeal. A billionaire has less clout than the owner of a operation that designs Mardi Gras floats or the bartender that is the lead of the Krewe of Elvi. I think that is what you would call "Soul" possibly. After travelling to a bunch of other cities and seeing unfettered capitalism destroy…

Unfettered capitalism has been doing a number on the rental market here lately, as I’m sure I don’t need to tell you.

That being said, if you got a critical mass of young techies down here that loved the culture, why not? It’s not that much dirtier or more dangerous than SF

Re: Cities and Ambition (2008)

#50

What message does Austin, Dallas, and Boulder send?

I grew up next to Dallas and just moved from Austin a few months ago. Both cities value relaxation quite a bit.

Naturally, there are motivated people and pockets (that will probably comment on this), but those are exceptions. That's what caused me to move.

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