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EFI Sucks (2012)

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41–50 of 76 posts

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#41
post #40

The one thing I really love about EFI on non-macs is that you don't need a boot loader. You just compile your kernel with an EFI stub and whatever you want in the initrd and then select it with the firmware GUI. That's nice

I didn't understand a lot of what you said. Any sources?

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#42
post #37

There's a lot about it that's bad, but the worst is definitely that it allows the firmware to keep running after the OS boots, interfering with its normal operation. Thanks to SMI, the system is non-deterministic: No latency promises can be made.

The same happens with BIOS, that is how many of its settings work.

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#43
post #40

The one thing I really love about EFI on non-macs is that you don't need a boot loader. You just compile your kernel with an EFI stub and whatever you want in the initrd and then select it with the firmware GUI. That's nice

I didn't understand a lot of what you said. Any sources?

The Arch Linux wiki has a good explanation: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/EFISTUB

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ... constantly bitching about what other people have built." Exaggerating to the extreme implies you do not have a strong basis for your argument. If you actually count the number of times he's bitched about something, it's probably like 20 or 30 (can anyone provide a real number?). And even then only 2 are debatable in their value. (also a made up number to demonstrate the lack of solid data on this matter.) There…

in my own personal experience, my primary source of linus news comes from articles being posted about him ranting or cursing about something. i didn’t post those. someone else did, and i read them. normally, i will follow these up with reading about various things about him and linux where he isn’t ranting, but those articles have been my portal to his world. why should i care to seek out more about one who i find is…

> my primary source of linus news comes from articles

It's easy to fall into survivorship bias[1] when "news" is your only exposure to a topic. You are only seeing the extreme events that were "newsworthy".

> why should i care to seek out more about one who i find is well known to throw e-mail tantrums

Do you want to have an accurate understanding of reality or the distorted view limited to whatever was sensational/scandalous enough to be "newsworthy"? When knowledge is derived only from the extreme cases that make headlines, people start to believe inaccurate generalization like "black people are criminals", "Muslims are terrorists", or "gamers are antisocial nerds that might shoot up a school" even though all of these examples refer only to the most extreme members of the group[2].

> but those articles have been my portal to his world

If you're going to make accusations about someone, you should probably check if those articles (aka indirect knowledge) are both accurate and representative.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qd3erAPI9w

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#45
Many of the issues are just that BIOS is old and stable while EFI and UEFI are new and immature. There should be a testing suite for UEFI like the CSS Acid test so there is a baseline of working functionality. But instead the test is ‘does it run Windows’ and that really is only a small part of it all.

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#46
post #28
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FAT32 is a good choice IMO. It's the simplest of the "mainstream" filesystems.

correct me if I am wrong but it's still patented by Microsoft. Also time precision is up to even seconds (i.e. it can not store file stamp 'modified at 10:00:01')

If the patents haven't already expired, they're probably expiring very soon. Windows 95 which was the first to have the LFN feature came out more than 20 years ago.

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#47
post #37

There's a lot about it that's bad, but the worst is definitely that it allows the firmware to keep running after the OS boots, interfering with its normal operation. Thanks to SMI, the system is non-deterministic: No latency promises can be made.

The same happens with BIOS, that is how many of its settings work.

Yes it does, but that's only of historical value by now.

Sigh, they had one job, and they managed to screw it up, so we do still have to put up with this.

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#48
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

correct me if I am wrong but it's still patented by Microsoft. Also time precision is up to even seconds (i.e. it can not store file stamp 'modified at 10:00:01')

If the patents haven't already expired, they're probably expiring very soon. Windows 95 which was the first to have the LFN feature came out more than 20 years ago.

With the sibling comment references: 2001-09-04 US6286013B1, so 2021. However that affect only long filenames which should be ok for EFI

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#49
post #39
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

correct me if I am wrong but it's still patented by Microsoft. Also time precision is up to even seconds (i.e. it can not store file stamp 'modified at 10:00:01')

> Also time precision is up to even seconds (i.e. it can not store file stamp 'modified at 10:00:01') In the pure form of the file system, yes, but with VFAT (which also adds long file names, creation time stamps, and access time stamps), the precision is exactly 1 second increments.

My main memory of VFAT comes from Windows 95 (or was it 98), I remember that when you saw this word anywhere, this meant your operating system is now borked beyond any repair.

Re: EFI Sucks (2012)

#50
I'll go against the grain here: I go out of my way to use UEFI over BIOS, because it Just Works for me.

When I got my first UEFI-using notebook in 2012 (same year as the submission), things were a bit rough because the Arch wiki did not quite know what it was talking about, and the Arch ISO was not UEFI-bootable, so you had to use some trickery to install an UEFI bootloader, but even then, it only took me two hours to figure out partitioning and install the bootloader.

Since then, stuff has gotten much better. Just recently, I switched my VirtualBox VMs to use UEFI emulation instead of BIOS emulation because it allows me to use the well-designed systemd-boot (previously known as gummiboot) instead of that absurd abomination called Grub 2.

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