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How poverty changes your mindset

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Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#191

Post by wildmusings »

AaronFriel wrote: post #139
wildmusings wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those living on the streets with severe mental issues probably don’t want to be in a mental institution. And unless they’re a danger to themselves or others (and not just in the sense of making bad life decisions), they can’t be held against their will. This is a free country.

It seems you think that either mental institutions are unfixable, or you have a very poor sense of the harms of say, untreated schizophrenia. This may be a free country, but we shouldn't use that to neglect our duty to our neighbors.

That’s not what I’m saying. We most definitely should offer mental care to people who need it, regardless of ability to pay. My point is simply that many of them don’t want it, and we can’t force it on them.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#192

Post by mcphage »

skookumchuck wrote: post #175
aswanson wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sentiments like these are why I can't Fuck with libertarians. Even though I never experienced as much, I know there but through the grace of God go I. And I don't believe in god.

Libertarianism is not about not helping others. Not even remotely. Libertarianism means you can help others as much as you want to.

> Libertarianism means you can help others as much as you want to.

What’s the political philosophy that means you can help others as much as they need? Maybe we should talk about that one more.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#193

Post by so33 »

throwaway1748 wrote: post #188
bojackstorkman wrote: post #30

I love how when this comes up, it's people either saying "Here was my experience when I was poor in the past." or "Here is what I think about economics or the wording of this article." Don't get me wrong, I know what website I'm on. But in all seriousness, is there room for currently poor people in this discussion?

If anything, I find that successful people are culturally un-welcome in the conversation today. It's considered presumptive or 'privileged' to give advice on how to be self-reliant and grow wealth. Culturally this is happening in a number of areas. Victimhood has become such a powerful status to claim that we increasingly refuse to listen to so-called 'privileged' voice, regardless of how solid their advice may be.

One of the top posts in this very comments section at the moment contradicts your claim.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#194

Post by mirimir »

Cyph0n wrote: post #190
chaostheory wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes those people probably have homes, jobs, and a family and friends support network. With the homeless, they are missing more than one of those things, if not all of them. Is it even possible to have a prescription when you don't have a mailing address?

And is it even possible to get access to such drugs if you can't afford them and have no health insurance? Genuine question.

You'd need to pay the doctor, and for prescribed drugs. Some doctors treat indigent patients at reduced prices, or pro bono. Also, food and drug chains often sell generics at discounted prices. And some US states prvide drug-discount services.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#195

Post by tjr225 »

skookumchuck wrote: post #175
aswanson wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sentiments like these are why I can't Fuck with libertarians. Even though I never experienced as much, I know there but through the grace of God go I. And I don't believe in god.

Libertarianism is not about not helping others. Not even remotely. Libertarianism means you can help others as much as you want to.

Which, in the case of most of the people who currently hold our wealth, turns out to be not very much at all. Are you surprised?

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#196

Post by SolaceQuantum »

chaostheory wrote: post #118
braderhart wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for sharing your story. I feel so much empathy towards you and your family, and I'm sorry to hear about your father feeling so bitter towards the system afterwards. I don't blame him. When I see people screaming and walking down the streets talking to themselves, I see people that need love. I see people that need to be taken in, not just for a night, but for a year or longer... so they can stop stressing a…

> When I see people screaming and walking down the streets talking to themselves, I see people that need love If they're talking to themselves, they need more than that. They probably need to be cared for in a mental institution. Unfortunately the overall national trend has been funding cuts, with the irony being that it doesn't save money overall; since the costs are just shifted over to hospitals and other emergenc…

> If they're talking to themselves, they need more than that. They probably need to be cared for in a mental institution

The statement that they should probably need to be cared for in a mental institution isn't true. That some or several may need to be cared for is true, yes, but the probability of that need is less well know. Schizophrenia and other schizophrenia-related disorders can often 'mellow out' on their own over time. [1] It is important to give someone a stable and loving and validating environment for them to be able to recover. There are several kinds of people who, while they talk to themselves, really just have their symptoms exacerbated by stress (e.g. schizotypal personality disorder can have quasi-psychotic symptoms triggered by stress).

1. https://www.nationalelfservice.net/mental-health/schizophren... (I will also note that this has been anecdotally determined, though I understand anecdotes are not data.)

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#197

Post by SubiculumCode »

bojackstorkman wrote: post #30

I love how when this comes up, it's people either saying "Here was my experience when I was poor in the past." or "Here is what I think about economics or the wording of this article." Don't get me wrong, I know what website I'm on. But in all seriousness, is there room for currently poor people in this discussion?

Sure. Just listen. If they mention that they are a graduate student or post-doc, then that is code for poor and in debt.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#198

Post by mixmastamyk »

memorymappings wrote: post #186

I grew up on welfare well into elementary school and my mom married my stepdad who was delivering oil to gas stations up driving all night on trucks. Before that I spent my first years in a trailer park where my mom had my older brother and I in her teens, living in a single wide with my biological father and his mother. My dad's mother and both of my parents were addicts and alcoholics. I was taken out of custody an…

Reminds me of the recent comic about privilege.

Most young people are quite sheltered, and many old ones as well. Ignorance is rampant. Wouldn’t take it personally.

Despite a lack of resources at least you got some brains, some in the same situation aren’t so lucky.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#199

Post by tmnvix »

tensor_rank_0 wrote: post #174
kraig911 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard to get people out of poverty than enrich people before that happens. It's easier to bring the extremely wealthy down to a certain level to accommodate for those that don't have the ability to get unlimited tries. See perspective:: http://www.templetons.com/brad/billg.html Wealth and safety nets give families chances where those in poverty can't afford to take. "Move across the country and change jobs or ris…

you listed a bunch of advantages of wealth that I dont think anyone would dispute. and you talk about taking that away. how is this supposed to help people who are already impoverished? it seems like you want there to be more people in poverty, not fewer. > http://www.templetons.com/brad/billg.html riddled with fallacies and calculated to produce envy. totally irrelevant to our discussion.

> you listed a bunch of advantages of wealth that I dont think anyone would dispute. and you talk about taking that away.

That is a non sequitur.

Re: How poverty changes your mindset

#200

Post by haberman »

bojackstorkman wrote: post #66
haberman wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I specifically asked if anybody had made room for, uh, the poor people. But what does this mean? Unless someone is specifically arguing that poor people should not comment, how is anyone not "making room for" the perspectives of poor people?

I am poor and volunteered my voice on the subject of how poverty affects people. I specifically asked (as a question, not a substantive statement) whether or not my input was welcome. I have also made a point of saying that I have no issue with other perspectives. I can not speak to how you experience my intentions in my writing, but I will try to keep clarifying.

I'm sorry if you felt I was misreading your intentions. Your message did not mention that you were poor, or that you were asking if you specifically are welcome to comment. My answer to that would be: of course you are welcome to comment. Nobody needs to ask permission to comment here.
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