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The Dropbox Foundation

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121–130 of 134 posts

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right so the grant is helpful and welcome, that’s why they accept it.

What/who are you arguing against?

The idea that charities take donations that damage them. They must be a net benefit, as otherwise they are free to turn them down and they would do.

People are using language like ‘damaging’ and ‘no choice’. What they really mean is the donations are useful but they could be more useful if unrestricted.

Well yeah lots of things are more useful when you don’t have any responsibilities along with them.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#122
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do these types of PR lines from companies that make productivity tools actually resonate with folks? In the case of Dropbox, for me, it comes across as cynical virtue signalling. If Dropbox were funding the EFF or the FSF or even dropping some funding to CCC or FOSDEM then I could start to overlook their ties with the sort of people¹ that create clients for Warchild. As it is this stuff comes across as pretty horri…

"Virtue Signalling" was a stupid concept to begin with.[0] But if you insist on using it, at least use it according to its actual meaning : proclaiming some supposed virtue without costs. In this case, it doesn't apply because they are, actually, spending $20 million. [0]: Because it's a cheap way to disparage anyone, cynically using the perceived virtue of their stated opinion against them.

My god the way you annotate your own post is infuriating

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#123
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t trust her at all. I have more trust in Microsoft than her so I moved to OneDrive the moment it was announced she was joining Dropbox.

Moving to Microsoft due to Condoleezza Rice being hired by Dropbox makes absolutely no sense. I'm not a US citizen, so I don't know about Condoleezza Rice and personally I don't care that much. But I do care about: 1. the Halloween documents 2. their NSA partnership 3. them being happy about censoring content on China's whims, which allegedly is also affecting international users 4. Windows 10 being a privacy nightma…

>I'm not a US citizen, so I don't know about Condoleezza Rice

Yet you continued to give your uninformed opinion.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#124
post #59
post #31

A foundation with 20M$ and these ambitious goals is a gift for the society. However, it is also the typical American way of company-society interaction. The actually intended way is called "paxing taxes". Dropbox, like a good part of the US tech companies, has it's European site in Ireland, a country known for its low tax rates [1]. [1] https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/business-spectator...

> A foundation with 20M$ and these ambitious goals is a gift for the society. However, it is also the typical American way of company-society interaction. The actually intended way is called "paxing taxes". Not really. It depends on what you think taxes should be paying for. If you think they should cover essential services that can't be taken care of by the private sector (ex: roads, police, national defense) then l…

>is a better choice

Well sure, the philanthropic model, which is in essence allowing the wealthy to control every part of society by determining what exists (i.e. is funded), who gets to live and die (by who they choose to give jobs to), what can be said (since every communications medium is privately owned), is a better choice for the wealthy, never for society or anyone else. It moves as much as possible of society from a public sphere where democracy exists into the corporate world, which is always a dictatorship.

The Bill and Melinda Gates foundation is great in that it funds research and development in educational pedagogy and techniques and funds education in general. But its existence is also explicitly anti-democratic. It funds schools that accept its doctrine, and leaves the others to wither and die. The existence of charity will be used to cut public support (why do we need public support when these schools are funded without it?) and then we have the setting where one billionaire effectively sets educational policy without democratic input at all. The Kochs are trying to do this by replacing standard American History textbooks with the history rewritten and changed to better serve as Libertarian propaganda.

Make no mistake, when you accept that philanthropy is a fundamental tenet of society you are literally ceding all decision making power to the ultrawealthy who can afford to take part in it, and cutting out nearly everyone else, ensuring they will be begging for scraps from their masters forever. You ensure that anything people have is framed as a kind gift from a wealthy benefactor (and you wouldn't want to make that benefactor mad and risk losing those gifts you need to survive, would you?), not a right or expectation. Even well-intentioned philanthropy is extremely dangerous.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#125
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving to Microsoft due to Condoleezza Rice being hired by Dropbox makes absolutely no sense. I'm not a US citizen, so I don't know about Condoleezza Rice and personally I don't care that much. But I do care about: 1. the Halloween documents 2. their NSA partnership 3. them being happy about censoring content on China's whims, which allegedly is also affecting international users 4. Windows 10 being a privacy nightma…

> And so your choice is dubious at best. Never said I trust MS, just that I trust them more than Rice.

You don't trust one person on their board of directors more than all the confirmed things that the other poster mentioned about MS? That doesn't seem like a very well calculated choice.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#126
post #2

Open Question: What's the consensus of opinion regarding Dropbox while they still have Condoleezza Rice on the Board of Directors? Personally, I want to love them. I think Drew has built up a decent company. However choosing Dr. Rice for the board, although she probably brings a lot to the table, was an unforgivable act. The creation of the foundation is laudable but feels a bit of a band-aid to solving their image p…

Why? It has nothing to do with where you host your files. You just seem to be making a knee-jerk partisan reaction.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#128
post #31

A foundation with 20M$ and these ambitious goals is a gift for the society. However, it is also the typical American way of company-society interaction. The actually intended way is called "paxing taxes". Dropbox, like a good part of the US tech companies, has it's European site in Ireland, a country known for its low tax rates [1]. [1] https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/business-spectator...

It is a big mistake to think that merely paying taxes is a sufficient substitute for donations. Governments are like the biggest of big companies: they tend to be very conservative about what they'll fund. Individual donors and small foundations play a crucial role in funding the sort of risky outliers that new ideas come from.

This is the opposite of true. Governments are the only entities that seem to be willing to fund basic research. And he department of defense, in addition to funding things like DARPA that have built the world as we know it, has proven willing to fund completely insane stuff.

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What/who are you arguing against?

The idea that charities take donations that damage them. They must be a net benefit, as otherwise they are free to turn them down and they would do. People are using language like ‘damaging’ and ‘no choice’. What they really mean is the donations are useful but they could be more useful if unrestricted. Well yeah lots of things are more useful when you don’t have any responsibilities along with them.

I think this is meaningless pedantry. It's like saying if I hold a gun to your head and tell you to dance, you always have a choice. Technically true but diluting the term choice past the point of usefulness.

More subtly, it's assuming that costs and benefits are somehow quantifiable in a single "benefit function". This is a modelling assumption that is often not true. There can be a benefit ("at least we can get some money to some people") that you can't turn down ("ethically can we turn down some money for some people like this?") while also being deeply damaging ("we are 'selling our soul' by acting as a PR arm for companies that want to improve their reputation rather than lives. This is damaging the ethical undeprinning and structural integrity of our organisation").

Summarizing this complex situation as a net benefit is naive and a bad model that will lead you to incorrect conclusions (like: "well they must get a net benefit, so it can't be that bad" rather than "we need to eliminate the structural factors that lead to such situations.")

Re: The Dropbox Foundation

#130

It is huge that they give unrestricted grants. I've been involved in the nonprofit world a lot in the last few years, and the most surprising thing I've learned is how depressingly common restricted grants are. Restricted grants are when you give money to a nonprofit to do what you want, rather than what they want. Usually this is some highly visible thing that the donor can then claim credit for. These projects are…

Sure, but that's only if you actually trust the non-profits in question to do actual good with unrestricted grants. Consider the example of the UNH librarian who ate frozen dinners and vending machine burritos for decades and donated his life savings to the school, only for the school to squander it on a scoreboard for their terrible football team:

https://deadspin.com/how-unh-turned-a-quiet-benefactor-into-...

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