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Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

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Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#91

Technologically speaking: Yeah, that's a nice feature. Real world: This will be awful, I really don't want any DB to have a photo of me associated with transaction or authentification. Yes, I do have profile pictures, but allowing a service to get a "stream" of your face will be way worse, and I cannot imagine what would happen if this DB get compromised...anyway...still a nice Black Mirror episode though..

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Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#93
post #7
post #3

Please, no. This has to be a parody. > Banks don’t want private account details (like the user’s current balance and credit limits etc) being seen by anybody other than the account holder. This is exactly the kind of justification they'd use. And surprise surprise there won't be a box that says "I'd rather risk somebody seeing my account details than have a biometric model of my face stored in your database and given…

Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? I guess it just comes down to a consequentialism vs deontology whether someone thinks this is a good idea. And, obviously, if they don't do it, I guess someone else will?

> if they don't do it, I guess someone else will

In my book, the ethical viewpoint would be, “someone else might eventually do that, but it sure as hell won't be me”.

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#94
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? But consider the fact that you are using terms out of the humanities, while most of my fellow CS students endlessly griped about how useless their humanities courses were and how they wished the school would get rid of that course requirement (six courses total over 4 years). Until we teach the tech-priests of the 21st century the great responsibil…

I'm not sure I agree the implicit assumption here that humanities courses necessarily result in more, well, humanity. In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. I was there to study computer science, not get a rounded education at someone else's insistence. And yet most of the really rapacious, conscienceless, anti-human stuff seems to me t…

I agree. It seems to come from the silicon valley culture more than anything. After all Peter Thiel, one of the more extreme examples of this sort of thinking, got a philosophy bachelors degree iirc.

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#95
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That could be, it I’ve never uploaded a picture of me anywhere, and I avoid having my picture taken. I’ve never had a social media account with my real identity either, and never had an FB profile, period.

Those are all good steps, and I do want to say, I think our society would be in a better position if more people were concerned about this as you are. I am sorry to be saying these downer things. I don't mean to be defeatist or tell you that there's no hope. It's just that the situation is really that dire. Phone cameras are high res. If you live in a city or go out in public often in busy places, then the sheer numb…

Damn, I'd never realised things had gotten that bad. I willingly share photos of myself online but that's my choice. It's sad that even privacy nuts can't hide themselves anymore.

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#96
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? But consider the fact that you are using terms out of the humanities, while most of my fellow CS students endlessly griped about how useless their humanities courses were and how they wished the school would get rid of that course requirement (six courses total over 4 years). Until we teach the tech-priests of the 21st century the great responsibil…

I'm not sure I agree the implicit assumption here that humanities courses necessarily result in more, well, humanity. In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. I was there to study computer science, not get a rounded education at someone else's insistence. And yet most of the really rapacious, conscienceless, anti-human stuff seems to me t…

> In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree.

Which depends almost entirely on the university in question. My computer science degree (Cambridge) had two separate courses focusing on ethics/humanities. Year 1 had Professional Practice and Ethics (which starts as broad as "Ethical theory. Basic questions in ethics. Survey of ethical theories: [...]. Advantages and disadvantages of the two main theories: utilitarian and deontological.", not just as it relates to CS), and Year 2 had Economics and Law (broad introduction to micro/macroeconomics, and a general overview of the law as it related to CS). The course introduction for the latter notes that you are to treat it as if reading a humanties subject:

> One word of warning: many part 1b students may never have studied a humanties subject since GCSE. It is a different task from learning a programming language; it is not sufficient to acquire proficiency at a small core of manipulative techniques, and figure out the rest when needed. Breadth matters. You should spend at least half of the study time you allocate to this subject on general reading. There are many introductory texts on economics and on law; your college library is probably a good place to start.

FWIW, I don't recall many complaints about the presence of these courses. Most seemed to find it useful to get a more rounded view, and it was a nice change of pace from tens of hours of pure computer science a week). It was also likely helpful for my later studies in Law.

https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/teaching/0809/EconLaw/

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#97
post #91

Technologically speaking: Yeah, that's a nice feature. Real world: This will be awful, I really don't want any DB to have a photo of me associated with transaction or authentification. Yes, I do have profile pictures, but allowing a service to get a "stream" of your face will be way worse, and I cannot imagine what would happen if this DB get compromised...anyway...still a nice Black Mirror episode though..

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Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#98
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do people really consider the ethics of introducing tech like this? But consider the fact that you are using terms out of the humanities, while most of my fellow CS students endlessly griped about how useless their humanities courses were and how they wished the school would get rid of that course requirement (six courses total over 4 years). Until we teach the tech-priests of the 21st century the great responsibil…

I'm not sure I agree the implicit assumption here that humanities courses necessarily result in more, well, humanity. In the UK, for instance, we have no requirements for a university degree other than the courses relevant to that degree. I was there to study computer science, not get a rounded education at someone else's insistence. And yet most of the really rapacious, conscienceless, anti-human stuff seems to me t…

Libertarians aren’t “anti-human,” they are anti-totalitarianism.

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#99
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Online proctoring is actually a really busy space in edtech. There are numerous companies with products deployed that are fully automated. They record videos of students taking the tests through a webcam, then send the analysis back to the instructors highlighting which videos are worth watching.

I never got the point of that. You can use a hdmi/dvi splitter to allow your accomplice to see your screen, and you can use your monitor's PIP function to allow your accomplice to send messages to you. both of which are totally undetectable to the student's computer.

It’s security theater.

Re: Face-verify.js: Monitoring who is physically looking at a website

#100

I can see from a privacy standpoint, this may cause some concern. However, from a credit card processor point of view and combating "friendly fraud". This could be an excellent tool to prevent that. For example. The scenario where a transaction has been processed and 6 weeks later, it is disputed because the card holder doesn't recognise the transaction. Perhaps the wife used the husbands card whilst he was in the sh…

Credit card processors and banks could do a lot to combat fraud that they don't do. Eg, realtime 2FA per transaction, which, as a bonus, could give the user a chance to categorize the purchase in their budget. They do exactly the amount of security that they think is most profitable - balancing losses to fraud vs abandoned sales because of inconvenience. Jumping straight to face recognition is a bit like physical sec…

N26 does real time 2FA for online card purchases. It’s super easy and painless.
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