11–20 of 63 posts
I wouldn't count on it going anywhere unless you become very blunt. They might be afraid to file for bankruptcy, you might get paid a bit if you threaten to sue, rinse, repeat as long as they pay up bits and pieces.
Until they go bust (which sounds like it is weeks or at most months away).
Two issues from my point of view: 1) You're owed the money legally. No question about it. You can probably even get it. California takes a very hard line on unpaid wages. 2) In the grand scheme of the situation do you feel good about fighting them over the unpaid wages? #1 is easy. You file a claim. You have a decent chance of getting your money. #2 is harder and it's impossible to know from the outside. I think it's…
I think it would be a weak move to avoid it completely, but maybe not weak to at least confront them and then show mercy.
But I think you're absolutely right, nobody here can really decide for me.
Answer, you can try to sue, but there's probably very little chance you'll get your money any time soon. Whether you want to pursue this or not depends on a few things. Do you feel they mislead you? Do you think they really have money and are just lying to you?
The flipside of my experiences was about 4 years after that scenario above, I did some contracting with a company - remotely (unfortunately) and they didn't pay. I found out from discussions that the PM on my project quit soon after I started, another developer on the project quit as well. He'd told me he'd quit because he was tired of the contractors bitching to him they weren't getting paid - apparently this was a habit company X had. I had other contractors seek me out and tell me they'd been shafted on payments too - one for $700, and another for $3500. Mine was to the tune of close to $9000. (never again!). So... I drove up to his state and filed a lawsuit. It's been > 2 years, and it's still in the system. Will probably take another year, and at that point, I'd still have to collect. At this point, it's a matter of principal - the company's whole MO was to farm out work to contractors in various states, then not send payment. That's a whole other level of evil, imo.
But maybe I'm biased and I really was as scammy as the guy who didn't pay me? I don't think so. I was honest with people - there's no money coming in - take another job if you can get one. That's not what happened to me a few years later, though perhaps some might see it as divine retribution?
So be sure to communicate that you still expect to be paid, and keep documentation on the amount owed -- ideally also a confirmation from them of the amounts. Making an official complaint to state employment authorities should be a consideration -- but one you neither rush to nor wait too long to pursue. Ask an employment lawyer about your rights and any deadlines for asserting them that may apply.
So my overall suggestion would be: (2), with increasingly aggressive nagging that gets them on the record with excuses/acknowledgments, and makes them realize you'll eventually go (1), so they might as well pay you as soon as they can.
I'd also be open to a settlement for less, but not be first to mention the possibility. If their fortunes improve, and you then assert your legal rights before they expire, you might get the original amount plus penalties/interest. So you have leverage unless it's a blood-from-a-stone situation.
These guys are scum for letting you work blindly without 1) having any idea how or when they would pay what they committed to and 2) warning you they're circling the drain. They deserve to get nailed for it. That said, it doesn't sound like you have a long employment history, so a cordial relationship and good references from them might be worth more than the money they're unlikely ever to be able to pay, no matter h…
You're not going to get the money back. 'grellas may hop on and set me straight on that, but what I expect will happen in the best case is that by pursuing a wage claim you start the machinery that finally puts your employer into bankruptcy, whereupon you become a creditor, lining up with all the rest of the creditors who aren't going to get paid either. Don't let my belief here imply that you shouldn't do anything;…
Indeed, that's my read too, but he shouldn't just shrug his shoulders and give up.
An option: Call them up, tell them you're short on cash and really need the money, and offer to take 1/4th of the salary you're owed if they can pay you shortly and it'd be a huge favor to you and you'd appreciate it.
This removes the small chance of getting the full amount, but it gives the very-important closure and gets the pay off the top idea on your mind - http://www.paulgraham.com/top.html
The cost to thinking about bullshit like this isn't considered enough. Offer to take two weeks pay and sign away the rest. Then be very, very grateful about it, thank them and say it's a big favor to you and you're rooting for them. You lose the small chance of getting full pay, but you get something and can move on with your life and devote your mental energy to other things.
Edit: The other nice thing about this route is that after going through that process, you're no longer a creditor to them and can call them up more freely without them tensing up and feeling the pressure. Depending on how valuable the contact/reference is for you, that could be better than going more hostile. If you did want to go hostile, small claims court might be a better bet than the wage board, depending on what the cap is in California. Small claims doesn't require a lawyer and is pretty straightforward to navigate on your own.
I was in their shoes once, and it was a horrible experience. I had paychecks bouncing at the end, some tempers flaring, and overall was about as miserable as could be. I'd suggested that people start looking for other jobs - there was no turnaround in sight. This was just a group of 5 of us - not some huge office, so we were closer (physically, if nothing else) than some other larger orgs that have gone through this.…
Our CEO would come into our office and say, "I just had a meeting with a potential investor and he's committed $25k!" He always had our hopes up, but our CFO would paint a different picture. Even our president told me he was starting to pick up work on the side.
Ballpark, what's a 'decent chunk of change?'. In my other comment, I mentioned I got stiffed for about $9k. Perhaps your situation is more? or less? I realize everyone's perception of 'decent change' is different, but I can tell you that at that point, for me, $9k was huge. I'd passed on other work for that contract, and then not getting paid was a pretty big hit. However, I managed to scrape through it (barely), hav…
What do you mean when you say you have diversified?
You're not going to get the money back. 'grellas may hop on and set me straight on that, but what I expect will happen in the best case is that by pursuing a wage claim you start the machinery that finally puts your employer into bankruptcy, whereupon you become a creditor, lining up with all the rest of the creditors who aren't going to get paid either. Don't let my belief here imply that you shouldn't do anything;…
It's worth noting that if you do resort to pushing the company into bankruptcy, at best you'll get nothing, and at worst you'll make things even more difficult for the founders than they already are.