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How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

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Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#41

Post by CamperBob »

ephermata wrote: post #31
ben1040 wrote: post #3

If I’d known about the anti-suit culture, I would have worn Dockers and a polo shirt. I just wanted to convey that I took the interview seriously. Apparently the feeling wasn’t reciprocal. This isn't the first time I've heard of candidates being looked down upon for wearing suits to interviews, and I'm really curious what the thought process is behind this. I've done interviews where the candidate wore a suit, and wh…

My first interview for a technical job, I showed up in a suit and tie. The rest of the interview had each person start by asking some variant of "wait, are you sure you're interviewing for engineering and not marketing?" The feeling this conveyed was that if you wore a suit, you couldn't possibly be a real engineer. I landed the job - a summer internship - but the suit was a distraction. It certainly did not help me…

Since then, I've taken to asking people what kind of dress code they expect on an interview.

Skulk around in the parking lot the day before and see what they wear. Then, dress one notch -- and only one -- above that standard.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#42

Post by evo_9 »

mkramlich wrote: post #35
evo_9 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, I'm 43 (yeah who let the old guy in here???). Maybe it's because I'm 43 that I have the opposite view of this; growing up in the 80's and seeing what kind of people wore suits (aka the 'greed is good' crowd), that probably had a negative affect on me. There is also Dr. Johnny Fever (WKRP anyone?) and his compelling 'Suits Versus the Dungarees' argument (sorry couldn't resist an obscure 80's ref...). But I want…

I loved that show! And M A S H. We're about the same generation. No I actually agree with you that the suit doesn't convey anything substantive, and if a programmer wore that today to an interview I'd find it suspicious because, at the very least, it means he/she is out of touch and maybe desperate. But that said, if the person has the technical skills to do the job, and is not a jerk, and is available and interested…

Hey cool on the HN meetup colorado idea. I've been wondering if there were enough to do one here. My email is on my profile, let's chat about setting this up.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#43

Post by Encosia »

fogus wrote: post #6

I would love to read stories of interviewees who've decided to call it quits on the interviewers. It must happen right?

> I would love to read stories of interviewees who've decided to call it quits on the interviewers.

In 2002, I was in a tough lurch between my first company's failure and a dire job market here in Atlanta. With -$210.00 in my checking account, it was all I could do to hide my excitement when a local auto insurance company called me in to interview for a senior/lead software development position.

I was almost immediately apprehensive when I arrived. The entire office basically amounted to an open call center, it was messy, and there were tangles of 10Base2 coax running haphazardly across the floor between computers. Not a good sign.

Though I had made it clear that I was interested in web development, it turned out that the job would mostly entail RPG and VB6 (what a combination). At that point, I was already looking for the door and thinking of polite excuses.

When the interviewer handed me a generic two-page application to fill out, as if I were interviewing for a job at McDonald's, I knew it was time to leave. I handed the application form back, thanked him for getting in touch with me, wished him the best of luck finding someone else, and navigated back through their 10Base2 obstacle course as quickly as possible.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#44

Post by pierre_M »

petercooper wrote: post #32

I wrongly assumed that someone would ask me between sessions if I needed to use the rest room. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the local culture but in the countries I've lived this strikes me as a complaint valid only for a child. When adults need to use the restroom, they make their apologies, ask where the restroom is and go. That aside, why would someone ask someone else if they need to use the restroom anyway? It's…

If you think someone's being timid and really does need a break, it's more common to ask if they want to "take a break" rather than asking flat out if they need to go potty.

I don't think I'd want to hire somebody who was too timid to say "Actually if you don't mind I think I'll go to the bathroom before the next session". It's not that complicated, and if you can't figure out a way to solve the minor social problem associated with your own bodily functions, damned if I'm gonna pay you to solve my problems for me.

And if I were being interviewed and somebody asked if I wanted to "take a break" I'd fail to interpret that as a euphemism for pissing and/or shitting.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#45

Post by pierre_M »

j_baker wrote: post #9
ben1040 wrote: post #3

If I’d known about the anti-suit culture, I would have worn Dockers and a polo shirt. I just wanted to convey that I took the interview seriously. Apparently the feeling wasn’t reciprocal. This isn't the first time I've heard of candidates being looked down upon for wearing suits to interviews, and I'm really curious what the thought process is behind this. I've done interviews where the candidate wore a suit, and wh…

I think it's mostly subconscious. I doubt anyone consciously thinks "That guy's wearing a suit. Don't hire him." However, people probably tend to take it as a sign that someone is dressing up to compensate for a lack of ability.

I think it's more to do with people being uncomfortable about being in a room with somebody significantly better-dressed, especially if the better-dressed person is in the inferior position. So they'll feel the need to make a joke about the suit-wearer's suit in order to put things back in the right order.

(This is, of course, flipped if the power difference is big enough; if the CEO is wearing shorts and the junior engineer is wearing a suit then the CEO won't feel uncomfortable -- it only works when there's a similarity of ranks.)

The rule of thumb is to wear to an interview a standard of dress just one notch higher than you expect to wear on the job. For a shorts-and-tshirt job you wear long pants and a shirt. For a long-pants and a shirt job you wear a sports coat, for a sports coat job you wear a suit, and for a suit job you wear a really nice suit.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#46

Post by angrycoder »

ben1040 wrote: post #3

If I’d known about the anti-suit culture, I would have worn Dockers and a polo shirt. I just wanted to convey that I took the interview seriously. Apparently the feeling wasn’t reciprocal. This isn't the first time I've heard of candidates being looked down upon for wearing suits to interviews, and I'm really curious what the thought process is behind this. I've done interviews where the candidate wore a suit, and wh…

It really shows that you didn't prepare for the interview. If its casual or business casual and you should up in a suit, you look like an ass. Besides, who codes in a suit and tie all day?

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#47

Post by groaner »

There are places that interview people with no intent of hiring them, but rather to prove a point: "We can't find anyone with the right skill set, therefore we must do X." Values of X may include:

- Outsource

- Find a cheap, indentured H1B employee

- Choose another technology path that was ignored due to politics

- Stick it to a manager who insisted that "anyone" could do this

- Use the inability to hire a new person as an excuse to steal someone from another team in the company

In the end, the interviewee is merely a pawn in the scheme of things.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#48

Post by blahblahblah »

lsc wrote: post #34
ben1040 wrote: post #3

If I’d known about the anti-suit culture, I would have worn Dockers and a polo shirt. I just wanted to convey that I took the interview seriously. Apparently the feeling wasn’t reciprocal. This isn't the first time I've heard of candidates being looked down upon for wearing suits to interviews, and I'm really curious what the thought process is behind this. I've done interviews where the candidate wore a suit, and wh…

you /look/ like a marketing guy. nerds don't trust marketing guys. If you show up in a suit to a tech. interview, my first thought is that you want to be management, not a tech; and you are just using this as a stepping stone. Now, if I /need/ management, that's great. But if I'm trying to hire a tech, it's a net negative. on a related note, I think there is a certain amount of hostility towards good looking people i…

Don't read too much into it. I've never gone to an interview in anything other than a suit and, trust me, if my employer asked me to fill a management role, I'd decline the offer (and if told that I didn't have a choice to decline, I'd start looking for a different job). I also never ever wear a suit for work.

The reality is that this phenomenon of wearing casual attire for interviews is a significant, and very recent, departure from the prevailing norm for white collar jobs and many people, myself included, have the "always wear a suit to a job interview" social custom as deeply ingrained in our consciousnesses as other customs like table manners. If the tech community were to abandon table manners in favor of "cave man" style dining, would you then hold it against an interview candidate if they opted to use silverware while dining with you? Bottom line, if the candidate is wearing a suit to the interview, assume they are doing it for their own comfort. To behave otherwise is, for that person, taboo.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#49

Post by philwelch »

ephermata wrote: post #31
ben1040 wrote: post #3

If I’d known about the anti-suit culture, I would have worn Dockers and a polo shirt. I just wanted to convey that I took the interview seriously. Apparently the feeling wasn’t reciprocal. This isn't the first time I've heard of candidates being looked down upon for wearing suits to interviews, and I'm really curious what the thought process is behind this. I've done interviews where the candidate wore a suit, and wh…

My first interview for a technical job, I showed up in a suit and tie. The rest of the interview had each person start by asking some variant of "wait, are you sure you're interviewing for engineering and not marketing?" The feeling this conveyed was that if you wore a suit, you couldn't possibly be a real engineer. I landed the job - a summer internship - but the suit was a distraction. It certainly did not help me…

The one time I tried asking, they actually did want me to wear a suit, and the way they phrased it seemed to imply that I was ignorant for having to ask in the first place. That was an odd experience.

Re: How to Screw Up an On-Site Interview

#50

Post by biotech »

j_baker wrote: post #13
fogus wrote: post #6

I would love to read stories of interviewees who've decided to call it quits on the interviewers. It must happen right?

You know, based on reading thedailywtf[1] for a while, I've concluded that it happens very infrequently even under the most absurd circumstances. Most of the time, the interviewee says something like "This was bizarre, but I figured I should just stick the interview out". I'm curious why that is. [1] http://thedailywtf.com/Series/Tales_from_the_Interview.aspx

"...I figured I should just stick the interview out"

I had that experience at an interview. Among other things, the interviewer was late, I was stuck in a tiny office with three people interviewing me, etc, etc. It was quickly apparent to me that they didn't respect their programmers. I decided half way through the interview that I had no interest in the job, and considered politely departing right then, but I stuck it out. I figured it was good interview practice.

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