Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’ • Hacker News Board

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#261

Post by enraged_camel » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:54 PM UTC

tomsthumb wrote: post #192

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

On the other hand, I have seen a coworker strongly imply that someone is a white nationalist for suggesting that it’s possible to be a non-racist republican.

One can be a non-racist conservative, in the sense of wanting a smaller government and less regulation. However, today’s Republican Party is undeniably racist, and supporting them also makes one racist in my opinion.

This is especially true since today’s Republican Party is not actually conservative. One cannot want smaller government while simultaneously supporting a drastic increase in immigration and border security and a whopping $25 billion for a 2000-mile long wall.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#262

Post by HumanDrivenDev » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:55 PM UTC

wz1000 wrote: post #99

sho wrote: post #46

What is crazy about the the situation in SF is that even 5 or so years ago if you asked me what the "echo chamber" there was echoing I would have said libertarianism and some kind of techno-utopianism. The takeover by the proscriptive far-left has been astonishingly rapid, and it is absolutely real. I also know people who have left, and many more who absolutely keep their political and even philosophical views to the…

> The takeover by the proscriptive far-left Americans have a very weird conception of what "far-left" means. Liberal feel good minority appeasement by billion dollar multinational corporations is as far from "far-left" as you can get.

> Americans have a very weird conception of what "far-left" means

And other Americans have a very weird conception of what far-left is outside of America.

There are nations out there that are very, very conservative compared to the US. Republican talking points would be far-left in much of the world outside Western Europe, Canada and Australasia.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#263

Post by huangbong » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:55 PM UTC

askafriend wrote: post #70

superquest wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"openly supporting" the winning presidential candidate isn't "absurd".

Yes it is. When you support Trump, you support his vile brand of leadership. The majority in this the country do not support this man or his ideas. They simply don't. The base that supported him and made this presidency possible is collapsing by all reported metrics (as in they are literally dying off, and younger people neither support Trump's ideas nor are they as religious). So while Trump's base may have squeezed…

“The majority of the country does not support this man or his ideas”, says the liberal SF tech worker from the comfort of his/her Google office where all of his/her co-workers also blindly agree (except for Paul from Minneapolis, who secretly voted for and supports Trump, who would probably get fired by HR due to “poor performance” after coming out about it)

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#264

Post by dragonwriter » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:55 PM UTC

sho wrote: post #252

frgtpsswrdlame wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? I mean you realize elections have real-world consequences right? It's not exactly like their team lost the superbowl. What about the dreamers, surely they're allowed to cry because of Trump's win right? What about trans people? What about those who would benefit from medical marijuana? What about those who have insurance because of 'Obamacare'? What about those with family members in 'muslim countries'? Maybe yo…

> you two are being just as tribalistic as the people you complain about You might be right. I just don't know what to do about political discussion these days. The punchline is, in case you didn't see any other posts by me, is that I've never not been on the left. In my defence I'll address a few points. The cannabis and DACA issues were not contemporaneous with the president's election, so exclude those. Trump prom…

> The cannabis and DACA issues were not contemporaneous with the president's election,

Trump, during the campaign, said he would immediately terminate DACA if elected, and also (by the end) had reversed his earlier position of leaving marijuana legalization up to the states, in favor of reinforcing prohibition. So, both were active issues in the election.

> Trump promised, disingenuously, "bigger, better" healthcare.

With no actual content except the repeal of the ACA.

> The Muslim thing was not known at the time

The Muslim ban was one of the earliest and most frequently repeated campaign promises, though the exact wording changed over time. It was not a policy preference that was out of the public awareness at the time of the election.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

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Post by hindsightbias » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:56 PM UTC

resu_nimda wrote: post #110

gameswithgo wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea what SF is like, so in these discussions I never can tell if there really is an influx of insane, insufferable far left crazies, or if people who insist on remaining racist and keeping gays in the closet are mad that nobody is having that anymore. The latter is what I see in my own circle of humans but I live in Texas. I can say though that I've moved further to the left as I've gotten older, from a li…

I never can tell if there really is an influx of insane, insufferable far left crazies, or if people who insist on remaining racist and keeping gays in the closet are mad that nobody is having that anymore. That's because it's entirely a matter of individual perspective and experience. Everyone takes their own tiny viewport onto a region of millions of diverse people and attempts to claim "oh yeah SF/bay area is like…

Crazy liberal SF/Bay, home of Feinstein - the Iraq War, AUMF, Libya War, Patriot Act and FISA Reauthorization supporter.

In TX, we'd call these people Republicans.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#266

Post by sebastos » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:57 PM UTC

mnm1 wrote: post #122

Great. He should get the fuck out then if he doesn't feel welcome. While some people might tolerate the kind of scum like Thiel, I think it's good that SV doesn't tolerate. There's plenty of other places Thiel and people who feel like him can move to. The area will be better off with people like him gone, IMO. Most open minded liberal people with half a brain aren't going to move to bumblefuck, usa for the same reaso…

Your vision for the future of America sounds incredible, how can I sign up? Seriously, I had never thought about it before but just dividing everybody up into high-school cliques that openly loathe each other, with no pretense of a common societal fabric... you should give speeches. This is a message people need to hear.

Can I find any more of your writing on this topic? I, and I'm sure many others, want to hear more.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#267

Post by anigbrowl » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:58 PM UTC

T2_t2 wrote: post #249

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

Isn't the rebuttal your post the heart of the whole current, I'm not even sure how to describe it, "listen" movement: your experience won't be the same as anyone else's? I wonder why that doesn't extend to a white, male, gay, conservative? I also think it is odd that we can see the flaws in everyone everywhere else, but the flaws in our own environ seem so hard to spot. I'm reminded of this in these times: http://www…

I wonder why that doesn't extend to a white, male, gay, conservative?

Thiel has been around for a long time and his views have been given extensive consideration - I'd say he's a well known public figure out here on the west coast. It seems to me that people have listened to him and that a significant fraction have subsequently arrived at a negative conclusion about him.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#268

Post by walshemj » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:59 PM UTC

adventured wrote: post #204

acjohnson55 wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not only that, but anything that would be considered truly leftist by global standards has tiny support within the Democratic party. What Bernie Sanders advocates, for example, is firmly centrist by European standards.

There is no such thing as European standards. Czech and Poland are entirely different from France and Denmark when it comes to such. Germany and Switzerland are also far different from France. There are at least a dozen nations in Europe with very aggressive hard right parties, often derived from former neo-Nazi parties, that have won a political seat at the table in the last decade. That trend is still continuing. E…

yes mostly former sov block countries where hard right nationisiam has taken hold

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#269

Post by cgag » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 9:59 PM UTC

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

The people I'm honest with about my politics are people I've sort of slowly sussed out as cool, we're all pretty afraid to state many of our actual opinions because we're not rich.

I don't care very much but there are a ton of people out there afraid of being damore'd.

Re: Like Peter Thiel, Tech Workers Feel Alienated by Silicon Valley ‘Echo Chamber’

#270

Post by manfredo » Sun, Feb 18, 2018, 10:00 PM UTC

strangeloops85 wrote: post #229

_skel wrote: post #169

I don't get it. I grew up in Silicon Valley and I work in tech, and so do many other people I know. They run the gamut from far-left socialists to libertarians to own a bunch of guns. They have all kinds of ethnic backgrounds and religious views. Some of my most libertarian/pro-gun friends have not been shy about their political views and it hasn't hurt their tech careers at all. They are far more welcome here than l…

Yeah I don't get it either, especially the "feeling alienated" part. Does that include being feted and having a respectful discussion with your liberal friend and old colleague, Reid Hoffman, on the Stanford campus on Jan. 31 of this year, moderated by a very sympathetic Niall Ferguson? With laudatory words and praise from the President and Provost? https://news.stanford.edu/2018/02/01/cardinal-conversation-r... Look…

This article isn't just about Peter Thiel, it's about tech workers in general. Not everyone has the luxury of being a billionaire, and knowing that they live comfortably for the rest of their lives even if they become unemployable. The sentiments expressed by quotes in this article:

> People in Silicon Valley “openly lie to one another out of fear of losing their jobs or being publicly crucified..."

> Sometimes Silicon Valley venture-capital investors and startup founders “have a certain way of thinking, and if you don’t fit into that way of thinking you’re not in the cool club”

are things that I can absolutely identify with. And I consider myself a moderate liberal, I can only imagine what mainstream conservatives are thinking.