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FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

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Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#21

Post by IntronExon »

nyolfen wrote: post #16
IntronExon wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe don’t state it? It’s their job to do something about it, not create diffuse bogeymen for ideologues to play with. What does telling us about a drop in an ocean do for us other than sow suspicion? Unless the danger is real and present, requiring public wariness and intervention, keep intelligence matters within the intelligence community. Edit: That article describes educational institutions run by the Chinese g…

the fbi is law enforcement. behaving as secret police is not a positive alternative.

The FBI’s remit includes domestic counterintelligence.

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#22

Post by thrillgore »

Here's where this statement is poisonous: I'm not sure if the FBI is actually being honest, or if this is some Trumpist bullshit that confirms how racist the current administration is.

Either way, I find it hard to believe. If its the former, its not shocking. If its the latter, it's disappointing but not at all surprising.

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#23

Post by nyolfen »

Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #8

Wow, this seems like straight-up racist fearmongering. The Chinese have "infliltrated" our schools by attending and starting culturally oriented studies? What's wrong with setting up classes for studying Mandarin, the #1 most popular language on the planet?

presumably the language classes are not the activity they are worried about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Confucius_Institu...

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#24

Post by IntronExon »

Analemma_ wrote: post #20
IntronExon wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe don’t state it? It’s their job to do something about it, not create diffuse bogeymen for ideologues to play with. What does telling us about a drop in an ocean do for us other than sow suspicion? Unless the danger is real and present, requiring public wariness and intervention, keep intelligence matters within the intelligence community. Edit: That article describes educational institutions run by the Chinese g…

> Maybe don’t state it? It’s their job to do something about it, You're presenting a curious case here. You want the intelligence community to respond to threats from state actors, but without ever telling the public that's what they're doing? There are two problems with this: 1. Government transparency - I want to know what the FBI is up to. You are advocating more opacity in their operations, for uncertain gain. 2.…

1. We’re not actually learning about what the FBI is up to, just a vague and unhelpful warning of infiltration.

2. The issue of infiltrating US institutions seems separate from overtly running ChiCom schools on US soil.

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#25

Post by Cyberdog »

Australia has of late had its own issues involving accusations of Chinese espionage as well as good old-fashioned palm-greasing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Dastyari#Chinese_influence...

If the US starts clamping down on this sort of thing, expect China to accuse the US government of xenophobia, since of course "we'd like to stop so many Chinese agents and toadies from infiltrating our governmental and educational systems" translates to "we hate Chinese people" in Mandarin.

EDIT: To be clear to any Chinese agents reading this, my issue is not so much with the spying and soft power campaigns so much as it is the unfair accusations of racism.

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#26

Post by knz »

Cyberdog wrote: post #25

Australia has of late had its own issues involving accusations of Chinese espionage as well as good old-fashioned palm-greasing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Dastyari#Chinese_influence... If the US starts clamping down on this sort of thing, expect China to accuse the US government of xenophobia, since of course "we'd like to stop so many Chinese agents and toadies from infiltrating our governmental and educatio…

New Zealand has had similar issues - https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/339335/national-mp-...

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#27

Post by Cyberdog »

thrillgore wrote: post #22

Here's where this statement is poisonous: I'm not sure if the FBI is actually being honest, or if this is some Trumpist bullshit that confirms how racist the current administration is. Either way, I find it hard to believe. If its the former, its not shocking. If its the latter, it's disappointing but not at all surprising.

You find it hard to believe that a major world power is conducting both espionage and soft power campaigns inside the US?

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#28

Post by IntronExon »

meowface wrote: post #7
IntronExon wrote: post #4

The FBI never changes, does it? I’m not even saying that they’re wrong, but stating it this way is just fodder for bin fires. It would be strange if China and others didn’t do this, and strange if the US didn’t do it to them.

Yes, of course, but it would also be strange if the FBI didn't warn about it when they identify it happening so that they can decrease the chance of intelligence gatherers getting what they want.

I agree with the general principle you’re describing, it I’m unconvinced that it applies in this case. Do you see what I mean? How does this warning empower the public?

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#29

Post by nyolfen »

GuiA wrote: post #19

Reminds me of this story from last year: But those [Chinese] students often bring to campus something else from home: the watchful eyes and occasionally heavy hand of the Chinese government, manifested through its ties to many of the 150-odd chapters of the Chinese Students and Scholars Associations. The groups have worked in tandem with Beijing to promote a pro-Chinese agenda and tamp down anti-Chinese speech on Wes…

https://twitter.com/marriottrewards/status/95134403140508467...

Re: FBI Says Chinese Operatives Active at Scores of U.S. Universities

#30

Post by seandougall »

nyolfen wrote: post #23
Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #8

Wow, this seems like straight-up racist fearmongering. The Chinese have "infliltrated" our schools by attending and starting culturally oriented studies? What's wrong with setting up classes for studying Mandarin, the #1 most popular language on the planet?

presumably the language classes are not the activity they are worried about. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Confucius_Institu...

They don’t seem to be terribly clear on what they are worried about, if this article is to be taken at face value.

The closest thing to a legitimate concern they can manage to cough up is that China might be stealing American research — but if that’s the case, why aren’t we more worried about other countries (say, ones that have less in the way of their own research resources than China)?

Edit: thanks for adding the link about CI — but I thought that seemed like kind of a sidebar in the article. They sound more generally concerned about the very presence of Chinese students.

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