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How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

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Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#181
post #159
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Breaking: Engineer Thinks PM is a Bozo. Film at 11. It's not really context. The real problem here is the premise that "Apple has software quality issues" is taken as a given, without support. Sinofsky makes the point that Apple is operating a such a huge, unfathomable scale and depth -- and this is coming from one of Microsoft's top guys in its heyday -- that even rare bugs that affect 0.01% of users translate into…

It's not "Engineer thinks PM is a bozo", it's a post explaining a very concrete, objectively negative behaviour from the PM team. I've worked at companies where that sort of behaviour was rampant, I've worked at places where it wasn't, and the difference in the end product is palpable. Second, even if it's just anecdotal, I have personally been experiencing issues with my tMBP at work that I haven't had with any prev…

> It's not "Engineer thinks PM is a bozo", it's a post explaining a very concrete, objectively negative

> behaviour from the PM team. I've worked at companies where that sort of behaviour was rampant, I've worked

> at places where it wasn't, and the difference in the end product is palpable.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of dismissing complains by saying that its normal for engineering to think that way about PM. There are different mindsets involved and it is definitely normal for them not to see eye to eye all of the time. It is also normal for them to want to prioritize things differently and there are some delicate balancing acts to be played between meeting legitimate engineering needs and pragmatically driving a product forward.

But sometimes, the PM really is causing problems by preventing those things from happening or by getting in the way of his own objectives.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#182
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The HomePod already plays stereo.

Not that I am aware of: https://www.engadget.com/2018/01/23/apple-homepod-no-mutli-r...

It cannot play from stereo separated with two connected speakers. The unit itself, however, has 7 speakers and it does separate the left/right stereo channels to different speaker pairs.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate on this?

Basically, Steve Jobs didn't want developers spoiling his phone with native apps as they did on Mac OS X. However, it quickly turned out that the native apps could do a whole lot more than the glorified web apps he was proposing, and this quickly led developers to figure out ways to run native code on-device. Apple, seeing the tide turning against it, created the iPhone OS SDK in an attempt to put a modicum of contro…

This is the version of history I believe too, but the SDK documentation was so good that people wonder(ed) if they were planning to release it after all, maybe not for the "sell on Apple Store, we get 30% cut" developer market, but for the big software companies.

It's incredible how many people became millionaires because of them, e.g. the makers of Angry Birds. Or makers of apps like Tinder or Uber.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#184
This is happening almost exactly three years after many of us came to the conclusion that “Apple has lost the functional high ground”.

Relieving to learn that Apple tries to get back into shape again!

Marco was right:

https://marco.org/2015/01/04/apple-lost-functional-high-grou...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8836734

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument doesn't really make sense: GUIs made a lot of software accessible to the average user, while web apps does nothing of the sort. To the end user, there are almost no benefits to using a web app; they're slower (yes, computers have gotten faster. That doesn't mean that the gap between web apps and native ones doesn't exist), they less accessible, they look worse, and they can't do half the things because…

The success of the GUI shows why computing is not driven by concerns over efficiency. PWAs being less efficient than native apps is completely irrelevant. What matters is functionality. Most apps do nothing that requires being native at all. The fact that PWAs have been implemented badly so far does not mean that there's anything inherently ugly, slow, or less accessible. Apple could go as far as they want in making…

> Apple could go as far as they want in making PWAs and native apps feel completely identical. They could even go as far as enforcing style, performance, and accessibility rules for PWAs.

But they have gone as far as they want, you should be happy then, or do you mean as far as you want? And isn't one of the points of web apps to not be enforceable by any single entity?

> The benefit of moving to PWAs are many and the downsides are all solvable.

Solvable only with hundreds of millions of dollars of investment and many many years of development. On second thought, they've had all that and are still not even close.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on your experience there what would you say is the cause of the recent slip in software quality in both iOS and macOS? As an outsider it looks to me like they're just pushing too hard to keep up with a yearly release schedule but that's based on no inside knowledge at all.

> Based on your experience there what would you say is the cause of the recent slip in software quality in both iOS and macOS? It's not clear because there have been absolute shit-show releases going back to the early days of OSX. Even the fondest-remembered releases were only so after a ton of polish, and that was with releases slipping significantly (you might see 3 years pass between major updates, and the new ver…

I don't recall a GIF like this ever appearing in any prior Ars Technica review of OS X: http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Sep-23...

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#187
post #11

Steven Sinofsky has a good Twitter thread about this [1]. He's one of the few people actually qualified to talk about managing platforms and operating systems at Apple's scale. [1] https://twitter.com/stevesi/status/963142502604779520

> 43/... Someone should do this poor guy a favor and set him up with a blog. Twitter is only slightly worse for writing essays than "yo" (yes, it exists; no, I have no idea whether it's a joke).

> "yo" (yes, it exists; no, I have no idea whether it's a joke)

Too many downloads for a joke... Maybe drug dealers use it?

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Based on your experience there what would you say is the cause of the recent slip in software quality in both iOS and macOS? It's not clear because there have been absolute shit-show releases going back to the early days of OSX. Even the fondest-remembered releases were only so after a ton of polish, and that was with releases slipping significantly (you might see 3 years pass between major updates, and the new ver…

I don't recall a GIF like this ever appearing in any prior Ars Technica review of OS X: http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Sep-23...

New reviewer.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 43/... Someone should do this poor guy a favor and set him up with a blog. Twitter is only slightly worse for writing essays than "yo" (yes, it exists; no, I have no idea whether it's a joke).

> "yo" (yes, it exists; no, I have no idea whether it's a joke) Too many downloads for a joke... Maybe drug dealers use it?

I used it to coordinate coffee making. Yo the coffee group when you are making coffee, and anyone could yo back to request a cup. Worked great.

Re: How Apple Plans to Root Out Bugs, Revamp iPhone Software

#190
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a slightly different perspective (I worked on iOS 7 - 11). One of the things about Apple that's different to many of the other tech conglomerates is that engineering teams are given huge freedom to work the way they want (for better and for worse). Because engineering is so fragmented you should always take what one person says about the process with a pinch of salt. So that means there are hundreds of source…

Based on your experience there what would you say is the cause of the recent slip in software quality in both iOS and macOS? As an outsider it looks to me like they're just pushing too hard to keep up with a yearly release schedule but that's based on no inside knowledge at all.

It's really hard to put any single root cause on it. Firstly, mobile OSes are massive beasts with lots of different teams working on it. Co-ordinating this becomes very difficult. Additionally, you typically get about 1 build a day which means there's a long lead time to find a bug that's managed to propagate out and then a long lead time for it to get fixed (at least 1 day). I think this decrease in quality has been seen across all OS vendors, it's just that Apple has become one of the dominant OSes so there's more press about it than there was about previous Apple releases.

So now you have a larger volume of bugs since bug count is based on the amount of code written, assuming best case that developer quality is roughly consistent across all teams. Since you have a larger volume and only so many hours in a day, trying to ship all software at once at an annual cadence means your bug count will go up regardless of how much QA you throw at the problem (since in addition to finding issues you have to fix them).

Automated testing might help because you could catch bugs before they're even submitted. Well, automated testing is still very hard on these devices when you're building the OS. For example, how do you do something as simple as build & run unit tests? If the answer involves loading code onto a mobile device that means (at Apple scale) you need a farm of devices. Moreover, your test isn't valuable if it's running against yesterday's OS. Might not even build/run because you've now acquired a dependency on an API made available in the new OS. So now you have to co-ordinate building the software using an SDK that may be unstable (build breakages happen), run it on an OS you somehow have to pre-validate works otherwise & then have some confidence that the bug found was introduced by your commit & not some combination of build issue, compiler bug (oh yeah - the compiler changes drastically too while your building your next OS), or downstream dependency bug. Finally, on top of all this you need to make sure you can recover bricked devices in an automated fashion so that the maintenance overhead of your automated testing cluster is manageable. All of these aren't impossible problems to solve. The problem is that it requires a lot of effort & physical infrastructure. Additionally, Apple has had a very ad-hoc development environment where no 2 teams are the same (it was slowly changing to unify large pieces of infrastructure when I left) which complicates the ability to roll out central infrastructure. Additionally, there are different needs - the kernel has different testing requirements/strategies from system daemons, from drivers from 1p apps from backward compatibility testing.

When I left a couple of years ago Craig had actually directed his teams to improve the automated testing infrastructure but at the end of the day the software is growing more quickly than the investment that was made in QA. There's also only so quickly you can roll out central automation infrastructure to an organization as large as Apple so it's not as simple as "do more QA" or "add more QA resources" not to mention that "QA resources" in automated testing typically requires very skilled software engineers to design & build the systems. Allowing a longer bake time is exactly the right move here as it recognizes the need to decrease the volume of bugs while infrastructure catches up.

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