Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback • Hacker News Board

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#101

Post by BookmarkSaver » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:52 AM UTC

ksenzee wrote: post #40

traskjd wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, also in Seattle and seem to recall a record long summer last year with 100+ days of no rain (well, one which just managed to trip it by volume at SEATAC in the middle). Personally, I think the whole 'Seattle has horrible' weather is pretty overblown. It's grey for a couple of months. I'm writing this now, in February, to a perfectly blue sky. It is cold, but not grey in the least. I've personally found it more c…

"Grey for a couple of months"? Are you an Amazon recruiter? Seattle had nine sunny days over a five-month period last year. It's objectively one of the grayest places in the US. Without the perfect summers we'd be fools to live here.

I moved here from Boston. It isn't even a comparison for me. Boston would basically shut down as a city multiple times a winter, roads would get blocked multiple times (and the trains would shut down), the general temp during the main 4ish month stretch of "winter" is a solid 30F lower, and with the windchill it can be actually physically painful to be outside even when properly dressed.

More sun is great, but I prefer regular drizzles at 40F to a clear sky in the single-digits punctuated by massive blizzards.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#102

Post by throwamzn6969 » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:52 AM UTC

amznthroway wrote: post #69

The hiring freeze has already been horrendous. We're told to keep hitting all our goals even if we lose people and can't hire to backfill. Now we're just straight up losing people to layoffs? Keeping the lights on alone is barely possible with the resources we have. It would be one thing if we were in dire straights as a company. Imho, this is just short-sighted nonsense so some senior leader can hit an arbitrary goa…

Guys like Bezos and Wilke don't really worry about their bonuses. It's not about bonuses, it's about becoming the first trillion-dollar company.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#103

Post by amorphid » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:53 AM UTC

amznthroway wrote: post #69

The hiring freeze has already been horrendous. We're told to keep hitting all our goals even if we lose people and can't hire to backfill. Now we're just straight up losing people to layoffs? Keeping the lights on alone is barely possible with the resources we have. It would be one thing if we were in dire straights as a company. Imho, this is just short-sighted nonsense so some senior leader can hit an arbitrary goa…

I've been contacted be 2 or 3 AWS recruiters in the last month, so presumably they are hiring.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#104

Post by BookmarkSaver » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:54 AM UTC

Negative1 wrote: post #87

At first I assumed this was a stack ranking type "cutting the dead weight loose" move but doesn't appear to be so. The article cites "too much staff for the work" but that seems strange; Amazon has never been bereft of ambition ("Think Big"). What would be the real strategic impetus for slashing hundreds of positions? How does this jibe with leadership principles like "Hire and Develop the Best" and "Insist on the Hi…

>"Insist on the Highest Standards"?

Don't maintain costs that that aren't adding net value?

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#105

Post by toomuchtodo » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:00 AM UTC

thinkling wrote: post #100

everdev wrote: post #34

I've always wondered how companies like Amazon and Apple with piles of cash justify not giving raises or passing laying off people. I understand that you want to be smart with your money but if I'm on the business end of this decision it probably hurts more than getting laid off from a company that's struggling and has no other options.

Apple throws off lots of profits and thus is sitting on lots of cash. (Most of it overseas.) As you probably know, Amazon profits have been marginal or non-existent. They use the net profit from some businesses to pay for expansion in others. To do that, they have to actually produce net profits in some of their businesses, i.e. keep costs under control. Bezos is using the older retail business to finance his newer,…

It’s the other way around. AWS subsidizes everything.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#106

Post by halbritt » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:09 AM UTC

mabbo wrote: post #93

davidw wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Got one today too. Put on a Gore tex coat and stood under the shower, on cold, for a half an hour, and decided that Seattle is probably not to my liking outside of, say, late July.

Eight months of the year it's drizzle every day. But the other four months, well they almost make up for it. I spent a couple of really great summers in Seattle. Plus, no snow unless you want it- then you drive to the mountains.

The first time I visited Seattle was the middle of July. The weather was warm and sunny. I recall going swimming in Lake Washington. Everyone was really, really happy and joyful, to the extent that I wondered if I had been lied to all my life about Seattle.

I guess SAD is a thing. Is there an anti-SAD?

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#107

Post by pktgen » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:12 AM UTC

jobu wrote: post #55

everdev wrote: post #34

I've always wondered how companies like Amazon and Apple with piles of cash justify not giving raises or passing laying off people. I understand that you want to be smart with your money but if I'm on the business end of this decision it probably hurts more than getting laid off from a company that's struggling and has no other options.

Laying off people is just a tool to get rid of low performers and cut costs. From the article: "A manager in one unit making cuts said his team was briefed that Bezos and the Amazon brass wanted to put more pressure on managers to weed out lower performers and enforce spending discipline after the rapid growth of recent years." Layoffs seem kinda shitty, but it's usually better than firing with cause. The worker will…

> The worker will still qualify for unemployment benefits

The worker would qualify for unemployment benefits even if fired for good-faith poor performance. For terminations, only gross misconduct (criminal acts, deliberately failing to work, etc.) is disqualifying.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#108

Post by msds » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:14 AM UTC

egypturnash wrote: post #83

davidw wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The PNW west of the Cascades is glorious in summer. Blue skies, clean air, no humidity, warm temperatures but not too warm. But the long, drizzly, gray winters are hell for those of us who like sunlight. If you want to move to the area, visit in November or March or something to get an idea of what it's really like.

January and February. That's where I always start to break down in misery. It's been cloudy for ages. The days are starting to get longer but they're still short. And I start wondering if moving back home to New Orleans would be all that bad. Surely that wouldn't coincide with a hurricane trashing the place twice in my lifetime, would it?

It was sunny today, and yesterday. It's been really weird, because I guess I had forgotten what sun was like...

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#109

Post by tyingq » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:17 AM UTC

A layoff of any kind or scale is interesting for AMZN, given that they have so much diversity of teams, jobs, skills, products, etc. It's interesting that they couldn't repurpose a few hundred people, even given their infamous up or out mentality. Sounds like they are knowingly giving up good people since the current culture fires anyone that doesn't produce already. Willingly giving up good people doesn't seem like a healthy signal.

Edit: Encountered this at a company acquired by private equity right before the 2008 bubble. They did 3 straight stack-rank/fire-the-bottom rounds. Was clear in the second round we were letting go of really good talent to the competition solely for some executive's bonus tied to short term numbers. And, it did bite them later.

Re: Amazon laying off corporate employees in rare cutback

#110

Post by thinkling » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:18 AM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #105

thinkling wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple throws off lots of profits and thus is sitting on lots of cash. (Most of it overseas.) As you probably know, Amazon profits have been marginal or non-existent. They use the net profit from some businesses to pay for expansion in others. To do that, they have to actually produce net profits in some of their businesses, i.e. keep costs under control. Bezos is using the older retail business to finance his newer,…

It’s the other way around. AWS subsidizes everything.

AWS is not digital devices. Digital devices is Kindle, Kindle Fire, Echo/Alexa, etc.

Q4 results [1] say North America produced $1.7bln in operating income, and AWS produced 1.35bln. When Amazon says "North America", I think they mean "North American retail". So while international retail lost almost a billion dollars, I wouldn't say "AWS subsidizes everything".

[1] https://seekingalpha.com/article/4142526-amazon-com-q4-2017-...

(Edit: Q4 produces more retail profits than other quarters while AWS is probably steadier, so on an annual basis AWS probably produces a larger part of the operating income. But even so, retail has been operating income positive, so AWS isn't "subsidizing everything".