Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#261

Post by smogcutter » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:02 AM UTC

tomcooks wrote: post #241

epberry wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Great reference to "Eternal September" - didn't know about that. I can now think of many examples of this happening to online communities.

You might also enjoy reading about ancient greek ideas of ἐσωτερικός and ἐξωτερικός

What would you recommend as a starting point? A quick google didn't have anything relevant, and Liddell & Scott just gives the straightforward interior/exterior definition.

I can see a connection between the eternal september and insiders/outsiders, but it sounds like you're getting at something specific and I'm curious.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#262

Post by twostoned » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:03 AM UTC

starpilot wrote: post #201

freehunter wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of folks here and on reddit and even back to Slashdot who had and continue to have negative reactions to incredibly popular things shows that it's really hard for techies to predict what will become a success. I don't think we're irrelevant or out of touch, I just think we really are in a market all our own. Look at the overwhelmingly negative response to the iPod, which then went on to destroy CD players…

And all the HN hate for the MacBook Pro touch bar and keyboard, while it sells incredibly well.

lol, Apple products in general. ;)

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#263

Post by bobthepanda » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:06 AM UTC

agorabinary wrote: post #184

jasode wrote: post #15

Facebook suffered from 2 waves of "Eternal September" [0]: wave 1: the addition of everybody outside your immediate friends and close family. You get the goofy uncle, the distant high school acquaintances, and all the work acquaintances from every previous job that submitted a "friend request" that you didn't reject out of politeness. The newsfeed gets polluted by nonsense such as forwarded memes, politics, and other…

We need a social network experience where users own their data, and are presented with a simple and user friendly interface that connects this data with their chosen friends. Currently we have user data mined en masse at great privacy risk and for endless profit, ad infinitum. Facebook has not decayed because of an influx of new users beginning with this "eternal september", but because of the pointed decisions by it…

Snapchat was fine for choosing who to send what to, though their UX is garbage especially with their new experience. Something like that with its separation of concerns, particularly advertising, but not photo-based, would be wonderful.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#264

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:11 AM UTC

graeme wrote: post #120

Facebook should watch out with Instagram. It feels considerably more draining now than it used to. There are messages, stories, suggested posts everywhere. On the search feed I often end up in auto-scrolling videos. These increase engagement and metrics. But, they produce an unwanted feeling of compulsion where instagram didn't before. I've uninstalled the app for a bit. I never felt like that about Instagram before,…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#265

Post by taneq » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:42 AM UTC

beamatronic wrote: post #60

btown wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention the erosion of the idea that it is default-safe to share your social experiences with your group of "friends." Adoption by colleagues and family shifts the tone considerably towards LinkedIn, where one's professional image is paramount - and all that does is make the platform more stressful to use. Facebook does provide tools to segment one's friends into groups to whom content can be privately posted,…

Hmm. Most folks I know address the colleague issue with a "no current coworkers" policy. (Not to imply you should immediately add newly-former coworkers).

So do you de-friend people if you get a job with them? Or do you regard people you add after you've finished working with them as 'real Facebook friends' and let them stay privy to your social life?

I know I've definitely experienced a bit of a 'chilling effect' on the stuff I post since adding a few former colleagues. Tech is a small town and you never know who you'll be working with next year.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#266

Post by zamalek » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:45 AM UTC

jasode wrote: post #15

Facebook suffered from 2 waves of "Eternal September" [0]: wave 1: the addition of everybody outside your immediate friends and close family. You get the goofy uncle, the distant high school acquaintances, and all the work acquaintances from every previous job that submitted a "friend request" that you didn't reject out of politeness. The newsfeed gets polluted by nonsense such as forwarded memes, politics, and other…

> wave 1

I've found that regular pruning keeps my utility on Facebook very high. I only really have to visit it once a week (as my newsfeed doesn't stream all that fast with only ~50 friends) and it's highly relevant. Apart from the constant nags to friend people that I don't know, that is - Facebook seems to take issue with my succinct friends list.

> forwarded memes

People who I give a damn about are posting to my timelines, so even the memes are mostly enjoyable. If they aren't, there is usually something enjoyable soon after precisely because my timeline moves so slowly: the signal to noise ratio is pretty good.

The downfall of Facebook is in limited ways PEBCAK. Facebook encourages degenerate use of the platform, but you don't have to fall for it.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#267

Post by dmix » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:55 AM UTC

StanislavPetrov wrote: post #226

RodgerTheGreat wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like facebook has a pretty effective scam for getting people to give them driver's licenses, passports and untold other treasure troves of personal information.

Twitter has been using a similar scam for a couple of years now. After several years of Twitter, my account was locked and they demanded my cell number to "verify" my account. No thanks - said goodbye to Twitter and never looked back.

I used one of those 'burner' apps that generate temporary phone numbers to bypass that. The only problem is if they continue to use that for authentication as the numbers expire unless you pay $x/yr.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#268

Post by dmix » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 1:58 AM UTC

driverdan wrote: post #236

graeme wrote: post #120

Facebook should watch out with Instagram. It feels considerably more draining now than it used to. There are messages, stories, suggested posts everywhere. On the search feed I often end up in auto-scrolling videos. These increase engagement and metrics. But, they produce an unwanted feeling of compulsion where instagram didn't before. I've uninstalled the app for a bit. I never felt like that about Instagram before,…

Instagram is so frustrating. I want to see all the stuff in my feed but they actively make it hard to do so. All I want is a complete chronological feed of media. No terrible sorting algo, no held back stuff to show me later, no suggestions.

I don't know why Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook, etc can't have a simple toggle between chronological and the default algorithmic feed... I've seen everyone complain about this for years online and it seems like such a simple problem to solve.

Much like searching for Tweets, Twitter provides a "New" vs "Top" filter which does that same...

It has nothing to do with advertising as both views can include ads.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#269

Post by overgard » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:03 AM UTC

I'm 32. I'm at the point where I'll update my facebook about once a month just so it doesn't look like a total ghost town if someone adds me, but otherwise I just stay away from it.

I find that the structure of it encourages people to post things that just appeal to the lowest common denominator. My feed is full of trite positivity memes and cute girls taking selfies and saying stuff like "Coffee with friends!" It's.. fine? I just don't feel any connection to other people when I'm on there, and I don't really feel free to actually state real ideas or opinions, so it barely even feels particularly "social" to me. It's just a lot of people acting as their own PR department mixed with a lot of people patting each other on the back.

Re: Facebook lost around 2.8M U.S. users under 25 last year

#270

Post by balls187 » Tue, Feb 13, 2018, 2:13 AM UTC

dmix wrote: post #268

driverdan wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instagram is so frustrating. I want to see all the stuff in my feed but they actively make it hard to do so. All I want is a complete chronological feed of media. No terrible sorting algo, no held back stuff to show me later, no suggestions.

I don't know why Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook, etc can't have a simple toggle between chronological and the default algorithmic feed... I've seen everyone complain about this for years online and it seems like such a simple problem to solve. Much like searching for Tweets, Twitter provides a "New" vs "Top" filter which does that same... It has nothing to do with advertising as both views can include ads.

> I don't know why Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook, etc can't have a simple toggle between chronological and the default algorithmic feed...

It's not that they can't have it. They have no incentive to do so.

Algorithm feeds provides the guarantee that an ad is seen by a minimum number of users, which is the entire value of facebook.