Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

thebaycitybeacon.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 187 posts

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#31

Post by watwat1 »

sheepmullet wrote: post #21
marcell wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. The parents of those children contribute to the economy and pay taxes, and by deporting them you are harming the local economy, and also reducing your tax base. Thus the gain will be less than $1200/yr. 2. Some of the kids of unauthorized immigrants are US citizens, if they were born in the US, so your number 12.3% is not accurate. That is the number who's parents are unauthorized. Edit: According to the source yo…

> The parents of those children contribute to the economy and pay taxes It's unlikely the parents pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits like free schooling for their kids. And at the same time by working here they illegally decrease wages and jobs for the most marginalized Americans. > Some of the kids of unauthorized immigrants are US citizens They wouldn't be here in the first place if we enforced our imm…

Cant upvote this enough!

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#32

Post by numbsafari »

yostrovs wrote: post #29

California always amazes with its goals, decade after decade of leadership among the states. Building is promoted to improve affordability. Building is discouraged to preserve the environment and maintain a local culture. Building is promoted to provide new transportation options. Building is discouraged to reduce congestion, contain sprawl. Building and not building at the same time helps California maintain its uni…

It’s as though California is a giant state with a diverse population, both politically and geographically, with lots of competing interests that, over time, has gone through various political and leadership changes that reflect that diversity.

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#34

Post by gsnedders »

phkahler wrote: post #25

The part about increasing density near public transit was interesting. It's true that high density is a must to make public transit viable. However, I presume there is little vacant land near public transit. In that case, a mandate to increase density would be telling people to demolish and rebuild with higher density than what's there. If that's the case then the comparison to Putin might be justified - and perhaps…

You don't have to mandate people demolish and rebuild: the market should adjust for this. (In short, if you have a one/two family dwelling on a piece of land, and each dwelling is worth $1.2M, then demolishing and rebuilding to provide five dwellings each worth $1.0M results in a net profit for the landowner.)

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#35

Post by geodel »

yostrovs wrote: post #29

California always amazes with its goals, decade after decade of leadership among the states. Building is promoted to improve affordability. Building is discouraged to preserve the environment and maintain a local culture. Building is promoted to provide new transportation options. Building is discouraged to reduce congestion, contain sprawl. Building and not building at the same time helps California maintain its uni…

It is an example of Doublethink [1].

"Doublethink is the act of simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts.."

I believe this site is also full of that all the time. From metered usage of all resources but internet, doctors vs bankers pay and so on.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#36

Post by jrs95 »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #5

My experience in driving through California's interior doesn't jibe with that headline. When I stop for lunch or a break I like to check out the local real estate scene and its often the case in these cities that there are many houses and other living accommodations available at modest prices. Hard to imagine a city like Mojave not meeting it "goal". Of course if you limit yourself to cities of 1 millions residents o…

Intentionally impeding federal law enforcement from arresting and deporting illegal immigrants probably isn’t helping them on those metrics either. But until just recently, they were allowed to have non citizens counted in the census for representation, and of course there’s always potential future amnesty and birthright citizenship ensuring they produce more loyal Democratic voters.

Seems to me like CA doesn’t mind putting political power before the well-being of its citizens.

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#37

Post by jrs95 »

omegaworks wrote: post #8
blasteye wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And being 42nd out of 50 on K-12 education and highest poverty rate, aren't good things to lead with. Lots of opportunities to improve. How much does that have to do with its sanctuary status & high illegal immigration numbers. California is home to 2.3 mil illegal immigrants, and 12.3% of all k-12 students in California are illegal immigrants. Other states with that high of an illegal immigrant student demographic…

>How much does that have to do with its sanctuary status & high illegal immigration numbers. Zero. It has zero to do with how California treats its most vulnerable immigrant population, and everything to do with how California funds its schools. The Berkeley CA School board recently had to make hard choices in its yearly budget. Berkeley is one of the wealthiest cities in the state. It was forced to slash safety offi…

Do you actually think California is trying so hard to keep these people out of altruism? This is clearly just an electoral strategy. And there’s no way that with such large numbers of a very poor foreign population that it isn’t going to disrupt institutions and daily life in California.

And that isn’t a moral judgement of any of those individuals, it’s just a reality that negative social conditions have a big impact on schools in particular. The wealthier schools aren’t just doing better because they have more money per student, they’re doing better because the kids that go there have a better social environment. You could pour 5x the money into the worst schools in the country and you wouldn’t be able to make a big improvement because the schools are not the root cause of the terrible social conditions in those communities.

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#38

Post by gravy »

Firadeoclus wrote: post #27
sheepmullet wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The parents of those children contribute to the economy and pay taxes It's unlikely the parents pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits like free schooling for their kids. And at the same time by working here they illegally decrease wages and jobs for the most marginalized Americans. > Some of the kids of unauthorized immigrants are US citizens They wouldn't be here in the first place if we enforced our imm…

> It's unlikely the parents pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits like free schooling for their kids . I think it's a mistake to assign the educational benefits people receive (whatever age they are at the time) to their parents.

I think it's valid considering it's usually parents who pay for their children's schooling if it wasn't free. The benefit here is monetary, not academic.

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#39

Post by PhasmaFelis »

geodel wrote: post #35
yostrovs wrote: post #29

California always amazes with its goals, decade after decade of leadership among the states. Building is promoted to improve affordability. Building is discouraged to preserve the environment and maintain a local culture. Building is promoted to provide new transportation options. Building is discouraged to reduce congestion, contain sprawl. Building and not building at the same time helps California maintain its uni…

It is an example of Doublethink [1]. "Doublethink is the act of simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts.." I believe this site is also full of that all the time. From metered usage of all resources but internet, doctors vs bankers pay and so on. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

Doublethink is when an individual holds mutually contradictory views. There are 40 million people in California.

Re: 97% of California Cities Failed to Meet State Housing Goals

#40

Post by theseatoms »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #39
geodel wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is an example of Doublethink [1]. "Doublethink is the act of simultaneously accepting two mutually contradictory beliefs as correct, often in distinct social contexts.." I believe this site is also full of that all the time. From metered usage of all resources but internet, doctors vs bankers pay and so on. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

Doublethink is when an individual holds mutually contradictory views. There are 40 million people in California.

Then what's it called when two counteracting policies produce outcomes that are strictly worse than no policy at all?
Post reply on HN