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“Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

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11–20 of 115 posts

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#11
I think the specialization of our society has really cost us in terms of becoming acquainted with death. My career path (military, medicine, pathology) has brought me in closer contact with death than most. And I'm a huge fan of Stoicism. Have read everything from Epictetus, Seneca, Aurelius. The act of witnessing death, the event itself, has had a profound centering effect. Be careful with the arrow of causality here.

Thinking about death is probably not that healthy of an idea. But exposing yourself to death is probably quite valuable. Consider volunteering at a hospital or nursing home, or even an animal shelter.

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#12
For some reason HN has been mimetically pulled into the seneca philosophy. Just so you guys know, there are many many many other philosophies and really great books about ways to look at life and how to live it than just stoicism. Don't let something as important as a life philosophy be steered by social media influencer culture. Take some time to read from sources outside your filter bubble. Your 70 year old self will thank you for it.

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#13

I strongly recommend Seneca's On the Shortness of Life . It's one of the best books I've read, and at the very top on the subject of Carpe Diem. https://www.amazon.com/Shortness-Life-Penguin-Great-Ideas/dp...

I just read it a few weeks back and was disappointed. His views on life seemed to boil down to something like "make as much wealth as possible, so you can retire as fast as you possibly can, so you can spend all of your time on whatever is meaningful in your life, and by no means ever have any fun." It seemed full of selfish anti-social advice for the extreme curmudgeon. But I also listened to it while on the road, s…

This is a short book, but it's full of ideas and already very concentrated as it is. So if you really think you can boil it down to a single sentence, I think you are in fact missing quite a lot.

I'm not going to go through the entire book point by point, but here are some salient points your summary misses:

One of the main points of the book is that when most people complain that life is short and they don't have much time they are mistaken. They are mistaken for various reasons, one of the main ones being that they waste their time.

Seneca would not agree with you that merely spending time "on whatever is meaningful in your life" would necessarily be a good use of your life. He goes on at length to decry the many things that even exceedingly rich people occupy their lives with that he thinks are a waste of time (such as vanity; chasing fame, wealth, or favor; being busy-bodies; concerning themselves with trivia, etc), and then talks about the things he thinks would be a good use of one's time -- the best according to him being (Stoic) philosophy.

He emphasizes that one should live for today, rather than for the future. "The greatest hinderance to living is expectancy, which depends upon the morrow and wastes today." "Everyone hurries his life on and suffers from a yearning for the future and a weariness of the present. But he who bestows all of his time on his own needs, who plans out every day as if it were his last, neither longs for nor fears the morrow."

So chasing wealth in order to at some future time have the leisure to enjoy it would be antithetical to Seneca, and is in fact one of the things he explicitly argues against:

"You will hear many men saying: “After my fiftieth year I shall retire into leisure, my sixtieth year shall release me from public duties.” And what guarantee, pray, have you that your life will last longer? Who will suffer your course to be just as you plan it? Are you not ashamed to reserve for yourself only the remnant of life, and to set apart for wisdom only that time which cannot be devoted to any business? How late it is to begin to live just when we must cease to live! What foolish forgetfulness of mortality to postpone wholesome plans to the fiftieth and sixtieth year, and to intend to begin life at a point to which few have attained!"

He's not encouraging the reader to chase after any get-rich-quick schemes either. The man upon whom fortune smiles today could be crushed under its foot tomorrow. Self-mastery and tranquility of mind is what he's after, as only then can one be indifferent to fortune's whims.

There's much more as well. This book is just so chock full of wisdom, I can not praise it highly enough. I really recommend you sit down one day, read through it slowly, and carefully think through each of the things he says.

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#14
post #12

For some reason HN has been mimetically pulled into the seneca philosophy. Just so you guys know, there are many many many other philosophies and really great books about ways to look at life and how to live it than just stoicism. Don't let something as important as a life philosophy be steered by social media influencer culture. Take some time to read from sources outside your filter bubble. Your 70 year old self wi…

Can you suggest few readings?

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#15
post #9
post #7

Aurelius said that all you have is the present moment so when you die the only thing you can lose is the present moment. That one really stuck with me.

But you don't lose the moment... you go into a new body. (Anticipating down votes for this, though)

You anticipated correctly yet you don't seem to realize why. Where can we possibly take this conversation now except into a religious flame war? If you had approached it from a philosophical perspective, we could actually have a fruitful (or at least interesting) exchange of words. As it stands you dove straight into belief territory, which obviously cannot be debated productively.

(I don't mean to be a jerk but I do mean to criticize your apparent lack of self-awareness.)

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#16
post #9
post #7

Aurelius said that all you have is the present moment so when you die the only thing you can lose is the present moment. That one really stuck with me.

But you don't lose the moment... you go into a new body. (Anticipating down votes for this, though)

The downvotes may be more from the baiting ("Anticipating down votes for this...") than the opinion expressed. Even Wikipedia (normally not a bastion of support for the "unexplained") offers a fairly balanced take on Stevenson's Twenty Cases Suggestive of Reincarnation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty_Cases_Suggestive_of_Rei...

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#17
post #14
post #12

For some reason HN has been mimetically pulled into the seneca philosophy. Just so you guys know, there are many many many other philosophies and really great books about ways to look at life and how to live it than just stoicism. Don't let something as important as a life philosophy be steered by social media influencer culture. Take some time to read from sources outside your filter bubble. Your 70 year old self wi…

Can you suggest few readings?

The Bible

edit: For those of you down voting me for whatever reason, can you at least contribute to the discussion and explain how my answer was a poor one?

The bible is one of the greatest stories ever told containing a myriad of different ways at looking at life.

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#18
I haven't read the article, but the general point is also a teaching in some kinds of Buddhist philosophy.

(Googling, others who know more about both have made this connection too: https://dailystoic.com/stoicism-buddhism/ For that matter, from that article: "[stoicism stresses] being in accordance with nature and accepting all of the things that happen in life" reminds me that the word "Islam" means "submission" in this sense too -- accepting what God gives you, i.e. what the 'universe' gives you. I guess there's probably some fundamental similarities at the root of most spirituality)

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#19
If you agree with this, it makes it a lot easier to realize what the current purpose of human life is, i.e., to achieve biological longevity. (By 'current' I mean until we achieve this, it's not of much use to ponder the bigger question of why we're truly here).

This mindset can be used as an alternative to existentialism in which you realize life has no purpose, and that is followed by 'you make your own purpose'. It helps eliminate some of the post-modernistic relativism and introduces some level of objectivity into this big question.

Re: “Study Death Always”: Seneca’s advice for living centered on dying

#20
post #12

For some reason HN has been mimetically pulled into the seneca philosophy. Just so you guys know, there are many many many other philosophies and really great books about ways to look at life and how to live it than just stoicism. Don't let something as important as a life philosophy be steered by social media influencer culture. Take some time to read from sources outside your filter bubble. Your 70 year old self wi…

People read Seneca long before the American self-help industry got its hands on Stoic principles. His huge corpus (letters and essays) is surprisingly easy to read and inspired many thinkers after him. It's a gateway to look further into ancient philosophies. Reading his letters at school also allowed us to glimpse the life and struggles of a wealthy Roman citizen.
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