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Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

theguardian.com

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Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#11

Post by prepend »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #9
goatlover wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is how many people really care enough to do much about it?

I think it's more brutal than that. How many humans are we willing to kill (or watch them die) in order to do much about it? Most humans care some about animals, but they care more about humans. (Yes, I am well aware that the developed world could accept a lower standard of living, and that would help. I question whether it's enough. And yes, I am aware that that is not an excuse for the developed world to do nothing…

This is a good point as while there’s not an agreed upon formula for how many nonhumans are worth a human, I’m certain that the vast majority will prioritize human life over animals.

Fortunately, the human growth rate is stabilizing so hopefully we can figure out how to have humans grow to a natural equilibrium AND keep diverse ecosystem. If the question is framed as either humans or animals, society will end up with only zoos, farms, and humans.

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#12

Post by derpaderp1 »

graeme wrote: post #6
dflock wrote: post #4

Not coincidentally, the human population has doubled in the same timeframe. Is everyone else screaming inside, or is it just me?

Planetary carrying capacity has to go somewhere. More humans + human animals and crops = fewer wild plants or animals That's just an intuitive thought, I am not sure if it is necessarily correct in all cases. It certainly at least correlates.

Hmm maybe people could stop having so many babies.

No that's crazy right?

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#14

Post by the_gastropod »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #9
goatlover wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is how many people really care enough to do much about it?

I think it's more brutal than that. How many humans are we willing to kill (or watch them die) in order to do much about it? Most humans care some about animals, but they care more about humans. (Yes, I am well aware that the developed world could accept a lower standard of living, and that would help. I question whether it's enough. And yes, I am aware that that is not an excuse for the developed world to do nothing…

I dislike this line of thinking. There's plenty we can do to reduce our impact on the Earth. Things like eating less beef, walking/bicycling when traveling short distances, reducing single-use plastic consumption, etc. go a long way. In the U.S., we think plastic takeout containers, driving 1/2 mi to the convenience store, eating meat every meal are normal. They're not; these are all absurd things the future will look back at with contempt.

If the world's population lived more like an average Indian, the human population could still roughly double without issue. If the world's population lived like an average American, we'd need 3.1 additional Earths to sustain us. [1] We're kind of jerks.

[1] http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33133712

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#15

Post by Parcissons »

prepend wrote: post #11
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more brutal than that. How many humans are we willing to kill (or watch them die) in order to do much about it? Most humans care some about animals, but they care more about humans. (Yes, I am well aware that the developed world could accept a lower standard of living, and that would help. I question whether it's enough. And yes, I am aware that that is not an excuse for the developed world to do nothing…

This is a good point as while there’s not an agreed upon formula for how many nonhumans are worth a human, I’m certain that the vast majority will prioritize human life over animals. Fortunately, the human growth rate is stabilizing so hopefully we can figure out how to have humans grow to a natural equilibrium AND keep diverse ecosystem. If the question is framed as either humans or animals, society will end up with…

Sorry, to curb your optimism. The limitation on humans, does not correlate with reduced ressource consumption. That flatline is multiplied with the ideal of a western lifestyle, which results in a ecological footprint as if everyone was his own large third world family.

My personal optimism regarding the wildlife comes from nature having assault weapons too- allergic substances, poisonous plants and multi-resistant vegies and bacterias and plagues. Ebola is the protector of monkeys- so if to carry ebola means your tribe is safe - that is a sickness that is a bonus point for continued existance. Same goes for nearly every human negative trait.

Mother earth takes a long time to recover, but when she does, boy will she beat us to pulp. My assumption is, that even if global warming is not wipe us of the planet, we will be living in domed communitys by the end of the century, simply because every sentient and non-sentient beeing is profiting from beeing resistant to all we got and effective at killing us.

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#16

Post by Santosh83 »

dflock wrote: post #4

Not coincidentally, the human population has doubled in the same timeframe. Is everyone else screaming inside, or is it just me?

Many of us also despair, but the world at large thunders on. Humanity seems to be collectively determined to march full speed ahead and face any problems as they happen. Sadly this means the planet is going to lose a majority of its genetic and ecological diversity, and that is going to be a great loss to us from several angles, but modern society and our economic structures are simply not placing value in such intangibles.

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#17

Post by stevenwoo »

gramstrong wrote: post #8
JohnStudio wrote: post #2

Does anyone know the source of those stats? "steep decline of animal, fish and bird numbers was calculated by analyzing 10,000 different populations, covering 3,000 species" Logistically speaking, I'd like to know how they tracked that. I've seen how caribou are tracking in Canada rather effectively ( http://mffp.gouv.qc.ca/the-wildlife/hunting-fishing-trapping... ) However, specifics of their research I'd find very…

Not by tracking, really, but I'd assume by population sampling. Rough counting of a species in an area or on a migration path, and then comparing it to historical data.

There was a more recent study about insects in Europe confirming your assumption. https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-11-14/global-population-fly...

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#18

Post by ataturk »

jefflombardjr wrote: post #3

This article is from 2014. The fact that it is 2018 and we still have to convince people this is a bad thing is alarming.

You don't get it--the people who you have to convince live in Africa, India, China, and Indonesia. These are the most hopelessly ignorant and poor masses on the planet.

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#19

Post by CalRobert »

dflock wrote: post #4

Not coincidentally, the human population has doubled in the same timeframe. Is everyone else screaming inside, or is it just me?

Only a few people, I think. It's like we found the asteroid headed for Earth and instead of panicking, just shrugged.

There are probably fifty times a day I feel a deep seated dreadxiety about something I'm doing. Wearing synthetic fibre. Finding out a soap has triclosan in it. Using a disposable nappy. Eating an avocado. Eating fish (appropriately enough, eating said synthetic fibres in that fish). And yet I have colleagues who toss aluminium cans into the garbage when the recycling is RIGHT NEXT TO IT and they do. Not. Care. I don't know what to do. Individual action is meaningless - every gallon of gas I don't burn just makes it cheaper for someone else. Maybe even the driver who wants to mow me down. I despair.

Re: Earth has lost half of its wildlife in the past 40 years (2014)

#20

Post by ciconia »

CalRobert wrote: post #19
dflock wrote: post #4

Not coincidentally, the human population has doubled in the same timeframe. Is everyone else screaming inside, or is it just me?

Only a few people, I think. It's like we found the asteroid headed for Earth and instead of panicking, just shrugged. There are probably fifty times a day I feel a deep seated dreadxiety about something I'm doing. Wearing synthetic fibre. Finding out a soap has triclosan in it. Using a disposable nappy. Eating an avocado. Eating fish (appropriately enough, eating said synthetic fibres in that fish). And yet I have co…

If you really want to make a change, leave the city and go live in the countryside. You'll be able to consume less, grow your own food and be closer to nature.
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