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If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

nytimes.com

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Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#81

Post by JBlue42 »

yorwba wrote: post #59
Clubber wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because people aren't robots. That's not how the brain works. People can't concentrate 100% for 8-12 hours a day every day consistently. >What if your supervisor could identify every time you paused to scratch or fidget, and for how long you took a bathroom break? I certainly wouldn't want to work under those conditions.

I get that this might be different in the US, but in Europe, there usually are minimum requirements for break time to ensure that workers aren't overly strained. E.g. screen workers should take regular short breaks to rest their eyes. In that case, tracking could actually be beneficial by making sure that nobody sacrifices their break time to improve their quotas. It doesn't have to be used for detrimental purposes (…

We have something like that in law at least (a certain time allotted after 4 hrs of work or some such, lunch) but rarely isn't ever that direct. People being people will get up, walk around, get coffee, take a piss, etc.

Beyond that, at least in office work, you'll regularly see folks eating lunch at their desk and working through it even though by law they're supposed to be 'relieved of all duties'. This isn't because some supervisor said so but because they feel obligated to do so.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#82

Post by minikites »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #19
minikites wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about people with physical or mental disabilities? Do they deserve to be fired because they're less efficient than an able-bodied worker?

Already these folks have a different metric for success. Why would that be different here?

You said it yourself:

>Why keep a slacker around when you have limited slots for workers? Why not measure and retain good workers?

This overall attitude doesn't distinguish between "slacker because they don't feel like working" and "slacker because they're unable to work to the degree an able-bodied person can". Your premise reduces someone to their profit-generating ability alone.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#83

Post by Clubber »

JBlue42 wrote: post #81
yorwba wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that this might be different in the US, but in Europe, there usually are minimum requirements for break time to ensure that workers aren't overly strained. E.g. screen workers should take regular short breaks to rest their eyes. In that case, tracking could actually be beneficial by making sure that nobody sacrifices their break time to improve their quotas. It doesn't have to be used for detrimental purposes (…

We have something like that in law at least (a certain time allotted after 4 hrs of work or some such, lunch) but rarely isn't ever that direct. People being people will get up, walk around, get coffee, take a piss, etc. Beyond that, at least in office work, you'll regularly see folks eating lunch at their desk and working through it even though by law they're supposed to be 'relieved of all duties'. This isn't becau…

Also, I think that is only reserved for hourly workers. Salaried workers are exempt from many labor laws.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#84

Post by JBlue42 »

Clubber wrote: post #83
JBlue42 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We have something like that in law at least (a certain time allotted after 4 hrs of work or some such, lunch) but rarely isn't ever that direct. People being people will get up, walk around, get coffee, take a piss, etc. Beyond that, at least in office work, you'll regularly see folks eating lunch at their desk and working through it even though by law they're supposed to be 'relieved of all duties'. This isn't becau…

Also, I think that is only reserved for hourly workers. Salaried workers are exempt from many labor laws.

Probably depends on the state. CA has better labor laws than most and doesn't seem to apply it different for exempt or non-exempt:

https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_mealperiods.htm

Most places I've worked given an hour by default as part of company policy. My point was that a lot of folks will choose to work through their lunch instead of taking a walk outside or relaxing a little.

I recall when one coworker hopped on the Soylent train. They had this whole plan that it would free up their lunch to go do other stuff like go for a bike ride, check out a museum, etc. They essentially ended up chugging the Soylent at their desk and working their entire lunch.

Maybe I'm old school but I don't like giving my labor away for free. Work will always be there.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#85

Post by Clubber »

JBlue42 wrote: post #84
Clubber wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, I think that is only reserved for hourly workers. Salaried workers are exempt from many labor laws.

Probably depends on the state. CA has better labor laws than most and doesn't seem to apply it different for exempt or non-exempt: https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_mealperiods.htm Most places I've worked given an hour by default as part of company policy. My point was that a lot of folks will choose to work through their lunch instead of taking a walk outside or relaxing a little. I recall when one coworker hopped on…

FWIW, I like working through lunch so I can leave an hour early. I'm happy to work extra hours because I'm usually into what I'm doing, but I do extra at home, and at will (unless a client is screaming because of something we did).

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#86

Post by falcolas »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #80
falcolas wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I bring you in to write code, what's wrong with hiring and keeping only people who write a certain amount of code every day? Are you having a bad day because you're distracted? Too bad, you're receiving a reprimand for not meeting your quota. Do you need to get up and walk around because your back is sore? Too bad, that's time you should be spending coding. Are you stuck in the resolution of a problem? Too bad, pr…

...assuming total failure by the supervisor to account for these things. Which can happen anyway. I don't see it changing the game, at least not for that reason.

And the supervisor's supervisor.

"I see you had ten underperformers that you have kept on. Didn't you know our company is working hard to save money? I've taken the liberty to fire them, consider this your first warning."

Even the best managers will have a hard time trying to convince upper management that people who miss quotas are worth keeping on.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#87

Post by JoeAltmaier »

falcolas wrote: post #86
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...assuming total failure by the supervisor to account for these things. Which can happen anyway. I don't see it changing the game, at least not for that reason.

And the supervisor's supervisor. "I see you had ten underperformers that you have kept on. Didn't you know our company is working hard to save money? I've taken the liberty to fire them, consider this your first warning." Even the best managers will have a hard time trying to convince upper management that people who miss quotas are worth keeping on.

Again, nothing new here. Quotas are already measured by queues filled, boxes moved etc. This is not a game-changer, just a cost-saver.

Re: If Workers Slack Off, the Wristband Will Know

#88

Post by falcolas »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #87
falcolas wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the supervisor's supervisor. "I see you had ten underperformers that you have kept on. Didn't you know our company is working hard to save money? I've taken the liberty to fire them, consider this your first warning." Even the best managers will have a hard time trying to convince upper management that people who miss quotas are worth keeping on.

Again, nothing new here. Quotas are already measured by queues filled, boxes moved etc. This is not a game-changer, just a cost-saver.

Do you also hold the belief that it's OK for three letter government agencies to proactively collect intelligence on all US and foreign citizens, because they could do it previously using tails, phone taps, and cameras?

As you say, quotas have already decided many a employees fate. The difference now is the scale at which the lack of human judgement can be applied. Scale can only hurt affected employees; it can never help them.

You seem to have an unshakable belief in the people you have worked for and hired and their ability to treat their low-paid hires fairly. I've personally had that belief burned away by the realities of working in a minimum-wage job.

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