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This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

codeproject.com

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Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#31

Post by etal »

m0nty wrote: post #8

"This is what happens when you let someone who is lousy at designing interfaces, design interfaces." Fixed that for you.

I bet the data structures for this app look pretty much identical to this interface. It looks like the author read Joel Spolsky's "Painless Project Schedules", wrote a GUI to do that, then exposed all of the plumbing to allow endless tinkering.

Sure, the interface is pretty sadistic for Yet Another Scheduling Tool, but maybe the original goal wasn't to make another FogBugz -- maybe it started as a prototype to explore different ways of munging data from project schedules. Comparing the original Joel article to the current Evidence-Based Scheduling approach of FogBugz, it's possible that even the HCI wizards at Fog Creek hacked together a few obtuse prototypes before finally settling on the right combination of plumbing and porcelain.

Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#32

Post by mixmax »

yters wrote: post #28
mixmax wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very often it is. But it's not as simple as that. Try to turn things around - there are a lot of designers (and kids and grandpas) that code something up. This usually ends up as a horrible mess, not following any programming paradigms, spaghetti code, non-existing security, etc. We've all seen it happen. But you only see this if you're a professional programmer. Non-professionals don't see the detail, the design dec…

You're right, the shadow does give a sense of substance to their simple design, and the same idea is used in google maps. I can imagine how amateur the site would look without the shadow. Are there more fundamental design principles, or is it more a matter of experimentation and experience?

I'm not a designer, so I'm probably not the right one to ask - but for what it's worth I think that it is like everything else in life: a little talent and a lot of work will get you the experience needed to do good design.

When I work with designers I notice that the finished result is often very far away from the initial idea, and that the intermediate steps are obviously experiments in some direction. It is apparent that a lot of time goes into trying things out that are never seen in the finished product. It's probably a lot like writing essays: write a lot and throw away the 90% you don't really need.

So in short: I think there are no shortcuts, it's about experience and hard work.

Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#33

Post by timcederman »

wanorris wrote: post #23
timcederman wrote: post #6

I don't think it's for want of design ability - as rantfoil said a standard CS education just doesn't educate an engineer about how to design better. I think the lack of UCD emphasis is pretty strange really, it's not like even just considering the user requires graphic design skills or anything...

The lack of emphasis on usability in a CS degree program isn't surprising at all. In a software engineering program, it would be entirely appropriate, but in computer science, the focus is intended to be, well, the science of computer software (and to a lesser degree, hardware), not how to develop real-world software projects effectively.

I completed a computer engineering degree in embedded systems. Everything I have worked on has benefited from the courses I took during my PhD program in user centered and participatory design. How are people going to use their CS skills? I think it's very rare for someone's hacking not to have an effect on someone else even if it's just fellow engineers...

Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#34

Post by Todd »

halo wrote: post #9

I think this is overly harsh. As far as I can tell, this is a program made by a single person in their spare time and was then open sourced. This is what happens when someone develops an application for themselves based around their own needs and then decided other people might want to use it - I'm sure the developer didn't set out to create a "great user experience". Controversially, despite its ugliness and widget…

Agreed. I have used this app off and on for years. A very nice contribution on the part of the developer. I see the UI of this app as being more a symptom of the target audience. It is targeted to other software developers (I assume) since it is a project on Code Project. It is targeted to the power user elite. Every option is no more than a mouse click away and many are a keystroke or two away.

Your point is taken about bad UI design, though. There are many exemplary instances. I find that bad UI design can come from any number of functional roles.

Many programmers I know (myself included) have been around good and bad designers for so long, and have used apps similarly, that a sensibility has developed within us. Some of us also know about user experience and usability testing. If you seek elegance in code, you will often want the UI of your product to be similarly elegant.

Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#35

Post by natophonic »

PieSquared wrote: post #18

People who aren't specialists design interfaces they think they'd like. Programmers, therefore, design interfaces for programmers. This is going to suck for consumer apps, of course, because most people aren't programmers - but this is actually a good thing for other programmers. Take a look at Emacs or Vi - is there ANY way they can get more confusing and badly designed from a consumer-app point of view? Yet they're…

Indeed, bad design is bad design, but just because the dash and controls of an industrial lift crane are 'more confusing' than a Dodge Neon, doesn't mean the crane's designers sucked.

Being a UI designer has it's pluses, but while I've on occasion been lectured by a geeky accountant or sales guy on the pros and cons of multicore processing or platform independence or something, I've found that almost everyone in the company has strong opinions on why the UI designer's work sucks. It seems that 95% of the public are really "artists" (not that you could tell from anything other than the passion of the aesthetic opinions) just working to pay the rent.

Re: This is what happens when you let programmers design interfaces (PNG)

#38

Post by tfinniga »

halo wrote: post #9

I think this is overly harsh. As far as I can tell, this is a program made by a single person in their spare time and was then open sourced. This is what happens when someone develops an application for themselves based around their own needs and then decided other people might want to use it - I'm sure the developer didn't set out to create a "great user experience". Controversially, despite its ugliness and widget…

I agree - I think it would be a stretch to say someone 'designed' this UI. This is a small project, with an easy UI.

Getting a simpler UI would take more work, but just because someone is a programmer doesn't mean they can't design a good UI if given proper design requirements, and enough time.

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