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A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

theatlantic.com

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Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#21

Post by OnlyOnlyOnly »

spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

"It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII."

Britian and France lost their empires and were destroyed after WWII. Germany lost it's (small) empire already in 1918.

Russia became a major empire with their new Vassal states, the US grew as an empire now undisputed by Britain.

So it's clear both Russia and US would compete for power.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#22

Post by def_true_false »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

> The Red Army was indeed a savior.

Many who ended up in the soviet sphere of influence would beg to differ.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#23

Post by saiya-jin »

badpun wrote: post #12
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

> The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. That is under a big assumption that Stalin's USSR was actually better than Hitler's Germany. Since there were lots of people who fled Soviet-occupied parts of Poland into German-occupied ones (ho…

On Ukraine/east battlefields, german soldiers were initially greeted as saviors from Stalin. That tells you all you need to know about that fuckup Stalin's terror against, well everybody.

Those masses of poor soldiers did win the WWII in some sense, but it was not because of the utterly incompetent communist leadership, but despite of it. Anyway they would be shot immediately by their superiors if they didn't march blindly on german machine guns. And there is only so many bullets those machine guns can fire before barrels start melting.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#24

Post by tszymczyszyn »

dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

It is true that Russians helped in ending WWII but as others pointed they were also one of the initial aggressors and allies of the Reich. If not for that the war might as well end faster.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#25

Post by OnlyOnlyOnly »

ferkad wrote: post #15
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

Just do not forget they joined Germany in the invasion of Poland in September 1939. Only because of the termination of Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact by Nazies Soviets were forced to fight them.

Russia and Germany planned the division of Europe and invasion of Poland.

Stalin just was too clever for Hitler. Instead of attacking at the same time as agreed, he waited to make Hitler the only agressor.

He also before talked to the British and French and knew they would defend Poland. Stalins plan was for the capitalst nations to destroy each other then rule them. As Russia tried when marching towards a destroyed and weak Germany only stopped by the Polish in 1921.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#26

Post by tryonqc »

I finished reading Pilecki's reports (turned into a book) a year after visiting auschwitz. The reports are quite hard to read. I just had to know how somebody could get out of that camp. (Being in the military, he knew many people in the camp that helped him along the way)

This article is a great follow-up story for the book.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#27

Post by yeukhon »

ransom1538 wrote: post #16
spunker540 wrote: post #6

It’s amazing how quickly our Russian allies turned into our Cold War enemies at the end of WWII. I’ve heard a lot of blame on both sides, the US stockpiling arms, McCarthyism fanning the flames. But the end of this story drives home just how brutal Russia was. A wwii hero who not only deliberately went to Auschwitz for three years, organized prisoners, compiled intelligence reports, then escaped and fought bravely fo…

When Americans arrived in Berlin they were quite horrified. Over 100,000 women in Berlin were systemically raped by Russian soliders [i]. As an American/Englishmen witnessing this and ordered not to intervene created hate and disdain for the Russian forces. The American forces had no concept of what the Russian forces endured -- still not an excuse for rape. Eventually generals on the western side began forming plans…

It is so sad that rape is a common war crime in every war since very ancient time. Rape during WW2 was probably one of the biggest crimes after mass genocide. I am familiar with the Japanese’s rape crime but this is the first time I am hearing about this. Allies are no exception.

The psychology behind committing such crime is beyond the “sexual urge” excuse.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#28

Post by JoeAltmaier »

yeukhon wrote: post #27
ransom1538 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When Americans arrived in Berlin they were quite horrified. Over 100,000 women in Berlin were systemically raped by Russian soliders [i]. As an American/Englishmen witnessing this and ordered not to intervene created hate and disdain for the Russian forces. The American forces had no concept of what the Russian forces endured -- still not an excuse for rape. Eventually generals on the western side began forming plans…

It is so sad that rape is a common war crime in every war since very ancient time. Rape during WW2 was probably one of the biggest crimes after mass genocide. I am familiar with the Japanese’s rape crime but this is the first time I am hearing about this. Allies are no exception. The psychology behind committing such crime is beyond the “sexual urge” excuse.

I'm not sure what the correct psychology is. Add together 'shell shock', depression, a continuous fear of impeding death, repeated exposure to unimaginable horrors, separation from home and family for years at a time, and despair at ever reuniting with your loved ones. I wonder at those able to endure all that, and end up anything like normal.

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#29

Post by [deleted] »

tszymczyszyn wrote: post #24
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bone of contention and a heavily discussed subject, because the world is not a black-and-white place. The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. On the other hand, there was the Stalinist regime, ruthless rule, killing one's own p…

It is true that Russians helped in ending WWII but as others pointed they were also one of the initial aggressors and allies of the Reich. If not for that the war might as well end faster.

[deleted]

Re: A Man Who Volunteered for Auschwitz (2012)

#30

Post by badpun »

pmyteh wrote: post #18
badpun wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Red Army was indeed a savior. It is thanks to those masses of poor soldiers, of which eight millions died, that the horror of WWII last only five years or so. All Europe and all world indeed should be grateful to them. That is under a big assumption that Stalin's USSR was actually better than Hitler's Germany. Since there were lots of people who fled Soviet-occupied parts of Poland into German-occupied ones (ho…

It was unambiguously better if you lived in Great Britain or other places which were at war with Germany but not occupied post-war by the Soviets.

The Soviets were quite open about aiming for world conquest, starting with Europe. They tried it first in 1920, but Poland miraculously defeated them. WWII was another attempt (had Hitler not attacked first, Stalin would probably just attack Germany within a short period of time) - first Poland and Germany, then France, Spain, Italy, UK etc. It only stopped at Poland and Eastern Germany that time because of strong backing of the US for the Western Europe.
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